1 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:28,000 Hello and welcome to Word and Work an Intersection. 2 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:32,000 I'm your host Dale Meyer. This hour will talk with Dr. 3 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:33,300 Timothy Saleska. 4 00:00:33,300 --> 00:00:38,200 He's professor of Exegetical Theology and the Dean of Ministerial 5 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:39,200 Formation. 6 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:43,800 Wow, he's also recently published the Concordia Publishing House 7 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:50,400 commentary on Psalms 1 through 50 devotional songs is our topic today. 8 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:51,400 Hi Tim, 9 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:54,700 thanks for being with us. Hey, it's a pleasure to always talk with you Dale. 10 00:00:54,700 --> 00:00:55,600 Glad to see you. 11 00:00:55,600 --> 00:01:02,700 I miss seeing you on a more daily basis since I'm in retirement 12 00:01:02,700 --> 00:01:06,300 shuffleboard isn't what they all claimed it to be honest. 13 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:13,600 A couple preliminary questions tell us what exegetical theology means? 14 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:23,000 So in our area, our department, we really concentrate on how you interpret the Bible. How to read 15 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:27,800 the Bible as a whole and also how you understand individual text. 16 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:31,900 So we teach our students through the original languages Greek for 17 00:01:31,900 --> 00:01:36,200 the New Testament, Hebrew for the Old Testament, and we do kind of 18 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:41,200 close examination of passages in particular books or cross scripture. 19 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:42,300 So it's Bible study. 20 00:01:42,300 --> 00:01:48,100 So we all love to talk about it as a very spiritually and reaching 21 00:01:48,100 --> 00:01:52,400 Holy Spirit fill time together around God's word talking about what it 22 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:53,000 means. 23 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,800 How would we preach it what it means to us personally. 24 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,700 How is it relevant to our situation how does God speak to us through it. It's like Bible study. Great fun. 25 00:02:06,900 --> 00:02:08,400 Formation, it's right. 26 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:09,600 What does that mean for us 27 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:16,400 Lay people. That means I kinda oversee all our formation programs both the on-campus ones like our Deaconess 28 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:22,100 programs program our MDiv program our Resident Alternate Route program, but 29 00:02:22,100 --> 00:02:29,200 also our distance programs. So our SMP program Specific Ministry Pastorate 30 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:35,300 our EIT Ethnic Immigrant Institute of Theology, CHS Center for 31 00:02:35,300 --> 00:02:40,200 Hispanic Studies online Deaconess programs, all of which have 32 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:44,300 directors, which I work in collaboration with. 33 00:02:44,300 --> 00:02:45,600 Okay great. 34 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:50,700 My daughter Elizabeth works at Concordia Publishing House. 35 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:56,100 And when your commentary on Psalms came out, she said dad 36 00:02:56,100 --> 00:03:01,700 this is great because it's so devotional, you know, a lot of 37 00:03:01,700 --> 00:03:07,100 commentaries are well, we have an alternate manuscript on this and 38 00:03:07,100 --> 00:03:11,800 this is a hip al or whatever and verb form, which that's not 39 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,800 unimportant but devotional devotion. 40 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:16,400 So tell us about 41 00:03:17,900 --> 00:03:30,500 the Commentary series and especially your interest in the Psalms. First of all as far as the characteristic of the commentary I do have all that geeky Hebrew stuff in notes 42 00:03:30,500 --> 00:03:32,600 for people cuz it's really fun to go through it. 43 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:36,700 And so there is that for people who really want to dig deeply into the 44 00:03:36,700 --> 00:03:37,100 text. 45 00:03:37,100 --> 00:03:42,500 But what your daughter Elizabeth was talking about was parts 1 and 2 of 46 00:03:42,500 --> 00:03:51,500 the way I read the Psalms. So part 1 is a is a reading in which 47 00:03:51,500 --> 00:03:56,400 I look at it kind of in the context of the Old Testament and try to 48 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:59,700 give a coherent reading of the Psalm what's going on in the Psalm. 49 00:03:59,700 --> 00:04:02,700 What questions does it right raise. In the context of the Old Testament. 50 00:04:02,700 --> 00:04:09,200 In the context of the Old Testament. And then in part 2 I start to read the psalm in a more devotional from a Christian perspective 51 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:15,700 in the light of Christ and it builds on part 1 in that it tries to 52 00:04:15,700 --> 00:04:17,800 answer some of the questions that the 53 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:22,500 speaker of the Psalm or the voices in the Psalm have raised for me. And 54 00:04:22,500 --> 00:04:27,300 it is in that those two parts with particular the second part that 55 00:04:27,300 --> 00:04:31,100 I've taken a much more meditative and devotional stance. And my goal in 56 00:04:31,100 --> 00:04:37,200 that part was for a pastor who is teaching a Bible class on Psalms or 57 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,600 wants to preach on the Psalms would have kind of at least a good idea 58 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:47,100 of some direction to take in using the psalm in those kinds of 59 00:04:47,100 --> 00:04:47,800 settings. 60 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:54,200 My impression is that it is very difficult almost impossible for a 61 00:04:54,200 --> 00:05:00,600 21st century American reader to get into the context of that culture 62 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:01,900 so long ago. 63 00:05:01,900 --> 00:05:07,300 So that's why is that true and then that I assume would be at the reason 64 00:05:07,300 --> 00:05:11,900 why the first part, you know that the some of the geeky stuff is 65 00:05:11,900 --> 00:05:12,900 important. 66 00:05:12,900 --> 00:05:17,000 So some of that stuff important for trying to help people 67 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:23,500 understand the language that the voices poets used. And one of the 68 00:05:23,500 --> 00:05:27,700 practices that I tell my students is how do you hook a particular Psalm 69 00:05:27,700 --> 00:05:32,500 to the story of the scriptures and where. Because of how you hook it 70 00:05:32,500 --> 00:05:38,100 up will determine how you interpret the Psalm what meaning of the Psalm 71 00:05:38,100 --> 00:05:40,500 emerges and it is much like our hymns. 72 00:05:40,500 --> 00:05:45,500 I always give this analogy you sing a hymn the meaning of that hymn 73 00:05:45,500 --> 00:05:48,600 becomes obvious to us because we see it 74 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:51,300 in light of the Christian story of which we are apart. 75 00:05:51,300 --> 00:05:58,600 So the terms that come in a hymn such as faithfulness or justification 76 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:03,100 or sanctification have their meaning within that story. 77 00:06:03,100 --> 00:06:09,100 So does this mean that we read the Psalms with our Jesus glasses on? So 78 00:06:09,100 --> 00:06:14,900 I would say before you put your Jesus classes on read it in light of 79 00:06:14,900 --> 00:06:19,400 the Old Testament story God's dealings with Israel because the Old 80 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:24,000 Testament has huge the theological significance in and of itself. And 81 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:29,700 that theological significance helps us understand who Jesus is what he has 82 00:06:29,700 --> 00:06:30,500 done for us. 83 00:06:30,500 --> 00:06:34,200 Jesus didn't just drop down from the sky one day. 84 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:40,800 The Old Testament prophets Moses the prophets the poet's the Torah all 85 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:46,000 in their preaching in their institutions in their people 86 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:50,300 foreshadowed a for taste of how the promises were going to be fulfilled in 87 00:06:50,300 --> 00:06:50,400 Jesus. 88 00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:53,900 So if you want to know who Jesus is, you have to understand him in the 89 00:06:53,900 --> 00:06:57,500 light of the Old Testament. If you want understand the Old Testament, 90 00:06:57,500 --> 00:07:01,100 you have to know who Jesus is. So for example after Jesus rose from the 91 00:07:01,100 --> 00:07:06,500 dead he opened the disciples eyes and it says so they could understand 92 00:07:06,500 --> 00:07:07,100 the scriptures. 93 00:07:07,100 --> 00:07:14,500 So in light of Jesus the text of the Old Testament took on a very 94 00:07:14,500 --> 00:07:19,600 different kind of meaning than it had for them before Jesus had come 95 00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:23,600 and so we have kind of a both and approach. 96 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:28,100 I always discourage my students from just jumping right to Jesus 97 00:07:28,100 --> 00:07:33,900 because that will end the conversation about what the Psalm has to 98 00:07:33,900 --> 00:07:34,400 offer us. 99 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:40,700 And you will kind of stop all kinds of conversation with the Psalm. 100 00:07:40,700 --> 00:07:45,000 It's just like the answer to every question just about Jesus well 101 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,600 where you go from there, but there's a lot more the psalms have to offer. 102 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:53,600 So I'm guessing you don't have many Bibles at your home that are just the 103 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:54,900 New Testament and Psalms. No we don't. I try to look at the whole thing. 104 00:07:54,900 --> 00:08:06,000 One of the one of the old saws is the Old Testament Old Testament is 105 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,900 revealed in the new New Testament is concealed in the old the Old 106 00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:11,200 Testament revealed in the new so that's what you're saying. 107 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:12,600 Yes very much 108 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:17,300 so. And you know, we kind of try to teach our students that thoroughly 109 00:08:17,300 --> 00:08:20,200 otherwise, they won't be able to preach on the Old Testament 110 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:20,700 effectively. 111 00:08:20,700 --> 00:08:24,700 The Old Testament will become in effect just a New Testament story in 112 00:08:24,700 --> 00:08:31,700 your have tendency to allegorize it and to drain it of again 113 00:08:31,700 --> 00:08:35,000 it's theological significance and even the historical 114 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:41,790 historic acts of Grace of judgements salvation for speaking. Tell us about Tim 115 00:08:41,790 --> 00:08:47,400 Saleska, not the professor not to Dean but Tim Saleska and the Psalms? 116 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:53,300 So I was always interested in them 117 00:08:53,300 --> 00:08:59,400 when I was a parish Pastor, you know, it becomes very obvious that the 118 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:04,400 Psalms are the go-to texts that people want to hear and pray at these 119 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:11,300 really kind of poignant filled with pathless points of their lives. 120 00:09:11,300 --> 00:09:16,300 For example around the grave of a loved one. When you're in the 121 00:09:16,300 --> 00:09:24,600 hospital facing surgery or facing a daunting diagnosis. Psalms come to 122 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,300 mind on the lips of our worshipers in a Psalms of praise and 123 00:09:28,300 --> 00:09:34,500 thanksgiving as well as lament. And so any Pastor quickly sees 124 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:40,400 how the Psalms are filled with language that a kind of describes the 125 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:44,200 inner life of people that people. My daughter Elizabeth was 126 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,900 going through some tough times years ago, and I asked her in this this 127 00:09:47,900 --> 00:09:48,500 is a question. 128 00:09:48,500 --> 00:09:50,600 A parent is scared to ask 129 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:51,500 are you reading your Bible? 130 00:09:51,500 --> 00:09:56,500 And she said dad the Psalms there is no emotion that I have that the 131 00:09:56,500 --> 00:10:01,000 Psalms don't talk about. Again from Luther on down to the early church 132 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:07,000 fathers have noticed that and have used it in their practice of 133 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:09,200 reading and understanding Psalms, 134 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:15,200 yes. Could you walk us through a Psalm and and kind of devotionally the 135 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:26,400 two steps. You do what you will. This is going to be a little bit different than a normal Word and Work cause we're getting into a little devotional have thought, please. I should have brought 136 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,900 you the text for the Bible what I gave to you are some questions and 137 00:10:30,900 --> 00:10:34,900 notice. This is before we begin taping. This is 138 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:38,500 before yeah, I gave you those questions. People I was asking how do you 139 00:10:38,500 --> 00:10:39,500 meditate on the Psalms? 140 00:10:39,500 --> 00:10:40,500 And that was an issue 141 00:10:40,500 --> 00:10:46,100 I that I really had personally because you here throughout your life. 142 00:10:46,100 --> 00:10:48,900 Oh you want to meditate on a text from scripture start with the 143 00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:53,100 Psalms. But I always found out that when I start reading the Psalms, I 144 00:10:53,100 --> 00:10:56,700 hadn't really no idea what meditation means my mind had no direction 145 00:10:56,700 --> 00:10:57,300 to go. 146 00:10:57,300 --> 00:11:02,200 So you read stuff and they go well read the text 5 or 6 times in a row. 147 00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:05,500 So I do that and I go I'm still not understanding 148 00:11:05,500 --> 00:11:07,300 it just seems like a waste of time to me. 149 00:11:07,300 --> 00:11:14,900 And so I really had to thoughtfully think through that it took a long time 150 00:11:14,900 --> 00:11:20,400 and I finally realize that the way to bridge the gap between me and 151 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:21,000 the Psalm 152 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:25,900 and to begin to fill that abstract term meditation with some direction 153 00:11:25,900 --> 00:11:29,800 for my thinking and reading. Was to think about reading the Psalms 154 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:34,200 having a conversation with someone. And one particular thing about a 155 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:39,200 conversation is that not only am I listening and interpreting the 156 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:41,200 words of the person speaking to me. 157 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:46,600 I'm awesome modern monitoring what is going on inside of me as I'm 158 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:51,600 listening so that you know, we all kind of do this sometimes very 159 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:52,900 self-consciously. 160 00:11:52,900 --> 00:11:58,000 How should I react to this person and what this person is saying? Do I 161 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,100 agree with what this person is saying? Do I like what this person or do 162 00:12:02,100 --> 00:12:06,500 I not? How closely do I identify with what the person is telling me? 163 00:12:06,500 --> 00:12:10,900 How should I respond if I disagree do I need to withhold judgment? 164 00:12:10,900 --> 00:12:15,500 I really have this urge to blast out, but maybe that's not such a good 165 00:12:15,500 --> 00:12:15,600 idea. 166 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:16,900 Maybe I need to sit and listen. 167 00:12:16,900 --> 00:12:18,800 Am I sure 168 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:20,400 I'm understanding this person correctly? 169 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:21,400 So notice that 170 00:12:21,700 --> 00:12:26,500 at the same time that we are quote reading the words of a person we're 171 00:12:26,500 --> 00:12:28,700 talking to we're also reading ourselves. 172 00:12:28,700 --> 00:12:32,600 And to me that is how I fill that word meditation. 173 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:39,100 You have to learn to not only read the text but read yourself and how 174 00:12:39,100 --> 00:12:45,000 you are understanding and interpreting, incorporating, identifying with 175 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:49,100 the words that the poet is giving you. And so what I've given you as a 176 00:12:49,100 --> 00:12:56,700 number of gap bridging questions that help us get across the gap that 177 00:12:56,700 --> 00:13:00,200 is usually between us and an ancient text especially one that's an 178 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:01,600 unfamiliar text. 179 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:05,200 But also with a familiar text it helps us to get more deeply into that 180 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:05,600 conversation. 181 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:11,000 All of those questions are not conversation stopping questions but 182 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:12,800 conversation enabling question. 183 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,300 Would you share some of the questions? 184 00:13:14,300 --> 00:13:18,000 So some of the questions would be things like where recording the 185 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:19,400 speaker of the Psalm is God? 186 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:21,400 So for sample. Is God 187 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:28,200 pictured in a transcendent powerful way or is the psalmist giving us a more 188 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:33,900 intimate picture of God? So Psalm 2 for example. God sits on his throne 189 00:13:33,900 --> 00:13:38,600 in heaven, see how that transcended picture verses Psalm 23 The Lord 190 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:39,500 is my shepherd. 191 00:13:39,500 --> 00:13:43,300 I shall not want you see that's just right off the bat a much more 192 00:13:43,300 --> 00:13:46,900 intimate picture that he's giving us. My God, my God 193 00:13:46,900 --> 00:13:51,100 why have you forsaken me through the first part of Psalm 22 almost up 194 00:13:51,100 --> 00:13:53,800 until verse 25, whatever it is. 195 00:13:53,800 --> 00:14:03,000 That's all relevant. That's all so relevant to where we live day in and day out. Correct and you see and so that's kind of one of those 196 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:07,700 questions that helps you think about what the psalmist is doing. 197 00:14:07,700 --> 00:14:13,100 Notice the Psalms are different from Psalm to Psalm and also sometimes 198 00:14:13,100 --> 00:14:18,000 within the Psalm they'll shift their perspective and move for more 199 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:21,500 intimate to more the more omniscient on 200 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:26,300 almighty powerful God or the God of goodness and Grace as you proceed 201 00:14:26,300 --> 00:14:30,900 through the Psalm. Another important question is help and this is a 202 00:14:30,900 --> 00:14:34,900 tough one because people tend to skip over this way how close to your 203 00:14:34,900 --> 00:14:38,100 identifying with the beliefs of the speaker with experience of the 204 00:14:38,100 --> 00:14:38,700 speaker, 205 00:14:38,700 --> 00:14:44,100 okay. Again to go back to Psalm 22, My God my God, why hast thou forsaken me. Do 206 00:14:44,100 --> 00:14:45,100 you identify with that? 207 00:14:45,100 --> 00:14:50,500 If not, why can you imagine what that might be 208 00:14:50,500 --> 00:14:53,300 like? If you do identify with closely 209 00:14:53,300 --> 00:14:58,300 yes, this is how I'm experiencing God now is if he's not present for 210 00:14:58,300 --> 00:15:00,800 me. What you do about that? 211 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:01,500 Where do you go? 212 00:15:01,500 --> 00:15:07,700 Where do you find hope? So that identity question is something that I 213 00:15:07,700 --> 00:15:13,800 constantly ask myself. That is especially noticeable in those quotes of 214 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:17,100 call imprecatory Psalms where the psalmist will call down a curse on 215 00:15:17,100 --> 00:15:21,600 his enemies. You know, May they remain childless. 216 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:23,900 May their homes be smashed excetera. 217 00:15:23,900 --> 00:15:26,600 I have trouble identifying with those. 218 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:31,100 Why, what how what do I do with those? That voice seems strange and 219 00:15:31,100 --> 00:15:37,300 harsh and alien to me. The gap between me and the speaker is a really 220 00:15:37,300 --> 00:15:37,700 big one. 221 00:15:37,700 --> 00:15:39,400 How do I even begin to think of it? 222 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:43,900 You set up the next segment beautiful we talk about the imprecatory Psalms. 223 00:15:43,900 --> 00:15:48,400 I'm learning a lot here and I trust you are too will take a very short 224 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:49,800 break stay with us. 225 00:15:51,100 --> 00:15:52,600 Concordia Seminary St. 226 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:57,400 Louis provides continuing education resources for pastors and lay 227 00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:02,500 people to discover all the Concordia Seminary has for you visit us on 228 00:16:02,500 --> 00:16:05,100 the web at CSL. 229 00:16:05,100 --> 00:16:05,800 EDU. 230 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,700 Welcome back to Word and Work an Intersection. 231 00:16:11,700 --> 00:16:14,500 I'm your host Dale Meyer. Today our guest 232 00:16:14,500 --> 00:16:14,900 Dr. 233 00:16:14,900 --> 00:16:16,000 Timothy Saleska. 234 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:19,600 He's professor of Exegetical Theology and Dean of Ministerial 235 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:21,900 Formation here Concordia Seminary. 236 00:16:21,900 --> 00:16:28,500 He has written the commentary for CPH on Psalms 1 through 50 and we're 237 00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:33,800 looking now a little bit different for us at the Psalms as devotions. 238 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:40,200 You listed ways to meditate on the Psalms. 239 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:42,600 Where is God Is He King transcended? 240 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,400 Is he close by Shepard? 241 00:16:46,700 --> 00:16:49,200 Or has he abandoned us my God my God 242 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,000 why have you forsaken me. And in talking about that then you brought up 243 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,200 imprecatory Psalms. 244 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:56,300 That's a big word. 245 00:16:56,300 --> 00:16:57,600 We don't normally use it. 246 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,700 But I think we often feel it, tell about them. 247 00:17:00,700 --> 00:17:10,090 Well, those are Psalms in which the voice seems to ask God to punish 248 00:17:10,090 --> 00:17:11,090 his enemies. 249 00:17:11,090 --> 00:17:16,700 So you'll see this kind of its a daunting theme when you come across 250 00:17:16,700 --> 00:17:24,500 it because the voices sound angry and vengeful. Psalm 137 you mentioned 251 00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:30,200 during our break the speaker of the Psalm is in Babylon and the end of 252 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:34,500 that verse, you know, who blesses the one who dashes your babies 253 00:17:34,500 --> 00:17:40,600 against the rocks. Like what. And that's kind of epitomizes this 254 00:17:41,300 --> 00:17:47,700 theme of anger and vengeance that you see in the voices of the Psalms 255 00:17:47,700 --> 00:17:54,700 asking God to bring judgment that kind of judgment down on their 256 00:17:54,700 --> 00:17:55,200 enemies. 257 00:17:55,200 --> 00:18:01,100 It's such a tough theme that when you go to our hymn book, you will 258 00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:07,100 see certain Psalms that are not in the front of the that or certain 259 00:18:07,100 --> 00:18:09,300 parts of Psalms. That I used to bother me 260 00:18:09,300 --> 00:18:15,800 it doesn't so much anymore because in the space of the worship service 261 00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:21,000 if a Psalm is being sung or prayed we don't have the mental space to 262 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:26,700 kind of think about what that means too difficult. May your babies be 263 00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:27,000 dashed on the rocks. It doesn't do any good. 264 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:30,800 How do you pray that? 265 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:35,300 So I think those Psalms need to be dealt with when you have the mental 266 00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:38,600 space and time like in a deep Bible study where you can actually talk 267 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:41,300 about them and think 268 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:48,800 about what they mean and how to incorporate them into the whole idea 269 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:50,000 what it means to be Christian. 270 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:54,700 Is there a simple answer to these imprecatory verses? I think a simple answers are going 271 00:18:54,700 --> 00:18:55,900 to be deceptive. 272 00:18:55,900 --> 00:18:59,400 I do think you can use those as a spiritual exercise. 273 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:06,500 First of all to examine your own soul and anger that might dwell within 274 00:19:06,500 --> 00:19:09,800 you and remembering that God knows the thoughts of your heart. 275 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:17,300 So I kind of start there. So that he knows your anger and your sin and 276 00:19:17,300 --> 00:19:21,900 all of those kind of things and it would be surprising if the Psalms 277 00:19:21,900 --> 00:19:26,000 didn't have this note because they have every other emotion as Luther 278 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:31,100 says, you know. Every everything else so that it would be surprising if 279 00:19:31,100 --> 00:19:32,700 they didn't have this kind of thing. 280 00:19:32,700 --> 00:19:34,200 So the simple answer 281 00:19:36,300 --> 00:19:44,100 is the buy Tim Saleska commentary. I do have a big section on that. I kinda of have a unique take on it actually using it 282 00:19:44,100 --> 00:19:47,800 as a spiritual exercise to think about the world. Part of the reason we 283 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,500 westerners have trouble with those sentiments is because we've live 284 00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:51,800 comfortable lives by and large 285 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:57,800 we have not experienced the kind of violence and injustice that the 286 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:03,000 psalmist seems to be reflecting. And so we can use it to think about 287 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:07,800 the world and the church in the world throughout history, but even in 288 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:13,800 in modern times. But also we moved to this reminder that we live on 289 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,700 the other side of Jesus resurrection where God actually answered the 290 00:20:17,700 --> 00:20:23,300 in this unbelievable way answered the pleas of the psalmist when he 291 00:20:23,300 --> 00:20:26,900 poured out his wrath on his own Son. And so in the New Testament 292 00:20:26,900 --> 00:20:28,600 it's not up to us 293 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:36,300 to bring vengeance on those who despise our Lord despise the Gospels 294 00:20:36,300 --> 00:20:36,500 truth 295 00:20:36,500 --> 00:20:42,700 it's up to God. And what does God tell us to do in this life not hate 296 00:20:42,700 --> 00:20:46,200 other people but love to turn the other cheek. In the book of 1st 297 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:51,500 Peter, which I'm working on is exactly what you said Peter directs 298 00:20:51,500 --> 00:20:51,700 them. 299 00:20:51,700 --> 00:20:53,800 They would like to get Vengeance. 300 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,700 He directs them to Jesus who suffered for us. 301 00:20:56,700 --> 00:21:00,800 Now you mention that some Psalms are not in the front of the hymnal. 302 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:15,400 Okay, we know why. But one Psalm that is Psalm 46. Could you lead us through that? I would be happy to. I would be happy to and since it's Reformation even though your not going to see this for a month 303 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:17,500 this has been kind of one that 304 00:21:17,500 --> 00:21:18,700 we're all very familiar with. 305 00:21:18,700 --> 00:21:21,900 The reason I picked this for today is because sometimes when the Psalm 306 00:21:21,900 --> 00:21:28,000 become so familiar you think that there's nothing new and so I always 307 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:29,400 try to look at the 308 00:21:29,500 --> 00:21:30,700 familiar friends. 309 00:21:30,700 --> 00:21:32,000 Psalm 46, 310 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:36,100 Psalm 23 with new eyes. And help students to see them with new eyes. 311 00:21:36,100 --> 00:21:40,100 Some Psalms are much more foreign and they are like meeting a stranger for 312 00:21:40,100 --> 00:21:45,100 the first time. When you meet a stranger you have to extended them the 313 00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:50,800 courtesies of of hospitality of being able to listen patients all 314 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,500 those kinds of things if you want to get to know this person better, 315 00:21:53,500 --> 00:21:55,300 that's the same thing with the Psalm. 316 00:21:55,300 --> 00:21:59,900 Now, you're the lead us through Psalm 46. Familiar, but maybe not 317 00:21:59,900 --> 00:22:03,900 totally familiar Psalm and are you reading from the ESV? 318 00:22:03,900 --> 00:22:09,200 Well, I will translate into ESV for you. 319 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:18,700 Tell us tell us what book that is? Well it's not just the Hebrew text. It won't get in the way of our conversation you have to worry about. 320 00:22:18,700 --> 00:22:28,100 He's a scholar. Concordia Seminary has great scholars. Don't do that. But I just enjoy the Hebrew and what it gives 321 00:22:28,100 --> 00:22:28,500 me. 322 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:35,300 So one of the things that I the students really have to go with I 323 00:22:35,300 --> 00:22:37,500 have trouble if you have trouble with his two really slow down in your 324 00:22:37,500 --> 00:22:39,200 reading. You're going to have a conversation. 325 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:42,400 You have to be willing to sit with people, right? 326 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,800 If you're looking at your watch all the time, that's not going to be a 327 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:49,500 fruitful conversation, conversations tend to forget time and move 328 00:22:49,500 --> 00:22:49,800 slowly. 329 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:55,900 And then I said remember at the outset part of meditation is being 330 00:22:55,900 --> 00:22:56,700 able to read yourself. 331 00:22:56,700 --> 00:22:58,000 So that's what I'm going to do. 332 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:04,300 And so we actually work on this practice in class for meditating on a 333 00:23:04,300 --> 00:23:10,600 Psalm. Psalm 46 begins God is to us a refuge and strength, 334 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:14,600 okay. A couple things you can go as slow as quickly as you want stop on 335 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:19,400 the word God. I ask my students what God are they referring to? 336 00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:25,000 Notice that unconsciously we don't even ask ourselves that question. 337 00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:31,800 But it's an important question. Notice that the reason that we even 338 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,800 don't even answer it is because we assume that it's the God that the 339 00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:43,500 rest of the scriptures talk about and detail for us. So notice how I'm 340 00:23:43,500 --> 00:23:49,600 hooking the text right with the first word to the story of which the 341 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,900 Psalm is a part. But I think it's important we articulate who is this 342 00:23:53,900 --> 00:23:58,000 God and when you do that a whole in their it starts to open up. Oh 343 00:23:58,000 --> 00:23:59,200 this is the God who created the world. 344 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,200 This is the God who made certain promises to Israel. 345 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:07,000 This is the God who is faithful. 346 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:10,300 This is the God of which the prophet spoke and so on. It's kind of like 347 00:24:10,300 --> 00:24:17,100 Genesis 1 read slowly in the beginning God and stop. And notice that 348 00:24:17,100 --> 00:24:20,500 when you start to ask yourself that question then you 349 00:24:20,500 --> 00:24:23,200 ask yourself the question is this the God that I believe in? 350 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:24,800 Why or why not? 351 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:31,200 How is this God my God because it says he is for us a refuge. 352 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,100 Do you identify with the for us or not? 353 00:24:34,100 --> 00:24:39,600 If so, what gives you the right to identify with that us? See it's 354 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:40,000 important that 355 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:44,000 we articulate that kind of language to help people connect the dots 356 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:48,600 but notice those are all Gap bridging questions. And conversation enabling 357 00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,000 questions because rather than shutting down a conversation that lead 358 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:59,000 to more questions and more talk about how I identify. But notice by the 359 00:24:59,000 --> 00:24:59,600 second word 360 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:00,600 God is to us. 361 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,100 I'm identifying deeply with the us. Why? 362 00:25:03,450 --> 00:25:07,050 And again what gives me the right? And I might make a note that this is 363 00:25:07,050 --> 00:25:11,550 how the Holy Spirit plants and nurtures the faith in us. 364 00:25:11,550 --> 00:25:16,050 This is not just some Eastern meditation working. No. This is the Spirit working. 365 00:25:16,050 --> 00:25:16,650 That's right. 366 00:25:16,650 --> 00:25:21,350 So God is speaking through the Psalm we expect to be influenced by 367 00:25:21,350 --> 00:25:22,550 that's kind of another thing 368 00:25:22,550 --> 00:25:28,550 I emphasize. Unlike academic scholarship which can read a Psalm and 369 00:25:28,550 --> 00:25:32,050 keep it at arm's length more like examining a pot that you find in the 370 00:25:32,050 --> 00:25:32,550 ground. 371 00:25:32,550 --> 00:25:37,350 We have the assumption that God is speaking to us that he's going to 372 00:25:37,350 --> 00:25:38,450 influence us. 373 00:25:38,450 --> 00:25:42,650 That's why I like the metaphor conversation because we come away from good 374 00:25:42,650 --> 00:25:48,250 conversations changed in some way. Sometimes in earthshaking 375 00:25:48,250 --> 00:25:48,450 ways 376 00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:52,250 sometimes it's a little bit. But usually after a stimulating 377 00:25:52,250 --> 00:25:56,350 conversation our thought processes stimulated sometimes our lives are 378 00:25:56,350 --> 00:25:57,350 set on different courses. 379 00:25:57,350 --> 00:26:01,950 It's kind of it's the most humanizing thing that we do as people. 380 00:26:01,950 --> 00:26:03,350 You're doing that for us 381 00:26:03,450 --> 00:26:11,450 right now. Oh well thanks your very kinda. But again notice I've only gone through those two words God is to us and asked 382 00:26:11,450 --> 00:26:16,950 myself some of those questions. That especially how do I you know, you 383 00:26:16,950 --> 00:26:22,050 have to think about why you are included in that us why you identify 384 00:26:22,050 --> 00:26:26,750 how you're included in this larger story of scripture. Notice also that 385 00:26:26,750 --> 00:26:31,850 in the Psalms, you'll see the word that's translated as God Elohim. 386 00:26:31,850 --> 00:26:36,250 Those are usually when the psalmist is talking about the 387 00:26:36,250 --> 00:26:37,150 God of power. 388 00:26:38,350 --> 00:26:43,450 When you see his personal name, which is translated the Lord, Yahweh, you 389 00:26:43,450 --> 00:26:47,650 that's usually when you will see that the God of 390 00:26:47,650 --> 00:26:48,650 mercy and goodness. 391 00:26:48,650 --> 00:26:53,050 Now, that's kind of a general rule, alright but notice that this Psalm 392 00:26:53,050 --> 00:26:58,450 starts out with Elohim and so I'm already I'm making the assumption. 393 00:26:58,450 --> 00:26:58,850 Okay. 394 00:26:58,850 --> 00:27:04,250 This is going to be a Psalm in which power somehow is involved or power 395 00:27:04,250 --> 00:27:08,450 at play. Let's see if he changes as we go through the text. 396 00:27:08,450 --> 00:27:15,750 Maybe he does maybe he doesn't, okay. So you go to the next phrase. So God is to us a refuge and 397 00:27:15,750 --> 00:27:16,150 strength. 398 00:27:16,150 --> 00:27:17,650 I ask my students 399 00:27:17,650 --> 00:27:22,950 what kind of language is God is a refuge? Sometimes it takes a while. 400 00:27:22,950 --> 00:27:27,050 It's a metaphor. God is a refuge for us. 401 00:27:28,150 --> 00:27:33,750 The Psalms are filled with images and metaphorical language and notice 402 00:27:33,750 --> 00:27:37,750 this is a very familiar one, which means you have to stop and ask 403 00:27:37,750 --> 00:27:38,050 yourself. 404 00:27:38,050 --> 00:27:42,750 What is your mind do when you identify a metaphor? 405 00:27:42,750 --> 00:27:44,950 It's a formal characteristic of the text. 406 00:27:44,950 --> 00:27:49,050 Right? God is to us a refuge stop right there. 407 00:27:49,050 --> 00:27:50,550 You can gloss right over say 408 00:27:50,550 --> 00:27:55,350 it's old hat. But notice that when you try to interpret a metaphor there 409 00:27:55,350 --> 00:27:57,850 certain connections you make between refuge and God. 410 00:27:57,850 --> 00:28:00,750 How is God like a refuge? 411 00:28:00,750 --> 00:28:01,750 Okay. 412 00:28:01,750 --> 00:28:08,050 How is he not like a refuge in other words when calls God a refuge other perspectives of 413 00:28:08,050 --> 00:28:09,750 God are not addressed 414 00:28:09,750 --> 00:28:10,750 and may be suppressed. 415 00:28:10,750 --> 00:28:12,950 You know God as a warrior 416 00:28:12,950 --> 00:28:13,850 for example. 417 00:28:13,850 --> 00:28:15,450 God as an Avenger. 418 00:28:15,450 --> 00:28:20,150 God as King see those give you different perspectives on God. 419 00:28:20,150 --> 00:28:24,750 So take each one and I don't mix them all together. 420 00:28:25,950 --> 00:28:31,650 If if that's what the poet says God is to us a refuge. 421 00:28:31,650 --> 00:28:32,950 What is that? 422 00:28:32,950 --> 00:28:34,750 I'm asked this question the other day in my class. 423 00:28:34,750 --> 00:28:39,750 What does that imply about us and some of them immediately raised their hands 424 00:28:39,750 --> 00:28:43,750 some kind of trouble are fleeing because refuges are for people in 425 00:28:43,750 --> 00:28:45,950 trouble people on the margins. 426 00:28:45,950 --> 00:28:52,350 So it's giving you a certain picture of God as this quotes place to 427 00:28:52,350 --> 00:28:56,750 which you can go. Jumping ahead in New Testament First Peter chapter 1 Faith 428 00:28:56,750 --> 00:29:02,450 guards us garrisons us. So there you go I'm writing your commentary for you. Yeah, thank you. Send you the check. So God is to us a refuge. 429 00:29:11,050 --> 00:29:14,150 That's starts to raise a little a how question. 430 00:29:14,150 --> 00:29:16,050 How is he a refuge for us? 431 00:29:16,050 --> 00:29:16,450 Okay. 432 00:29:16,450 --> 00:29:18,150 What does that mean? 433 00:29:18,150 --> 00:29:24,950 One of the ways, I might preliminary the answer that is to think about 434 00:29:24,950 --> 00:29:25,350 it like this. 435 00:29:25,350 --> 00:29:30,850 You know, when I'm in trouble I have this inner movement to pray to 436 00:29:30,850 --> 00:29:34,650 God to ask God for help to seek his protection. 437 00:29:34,650 --> 00:29:38,650 So is that what he's talking about when he's talking about God as a 438 00:29:38,650 --> 00:29:40,450 refuge. How's he actually a refuge? 439 00:29:40,450 --> 00:29:42,550 It's not a question easily answered. 440 00:29:42,550 --> 00:29:46,850 You can hook it into the rest of the scriptures and begin to see the 441 00:29:46,850 --> 00:29:51,650 picture of God in the way that he has help his people, deliver his 442 00:29:51,650 --> 00:29:57,750 people through the ages. And ask yourself if that's true for you 443 00:29:57,750 --> 00:30:03,150 if so, why do I not. The problem only deepens in the last part of the 444 00:30:03,150 --> 00:30:03,450 line 445 00:30:03,450 --> 00:30:07,750 I think. Because it says this a help in troubles 446 00:30:08,450 --> 00:30:14,550 he is found then the Hebrew word he is easily found or in King James a 447 00:30:14,550 --> 00:30:16,050 very present help in trouble. 448 00:30:17,350 --> 00:30:20,150 That raises a huge question for me. 449 00:30:21,250 --> 00:30:28,150 Because so often trouble God doesn't seem to be there. Notice 450 00:30:28,150 --> 00:30:30,350 how many laments start off with God 451 00:30:30,350 --> 00:30:32,850 where are you? God you've abandoned. 452 00:30:32,850 --> 00:30:37,250 You see it's very he's making a very different truth claim 453 00:30:38,050 --> 00:30:41,650 then the experiences of others psalmist. The light at the end of the 454 00:30:41,650 --> 00:30:43,250 tunnel is a train coming at you. 455 00:30:43,250 --> 00:30:49,150 That's what we know about. So it seems. So here's what comes to my mind for years 456 00:30:49,150 --> 00:30:54,050 now. We sing A Mighty Fortress Is Our God with all this conviction blah 457 00:30:54,050 --> 00:30:59,450 and I'm always wondering about the poor people in the pews in the back 458 00:30:59,450 --> 00:31:04,450 who just lost their job who just been diagnosed with cancer who who 459 00:31:04,450 --> 00:31:06,250 are suffering terribly. 460 00:31:07,450 --> 00:31:11,650 I wonder how you how it how do they sing that how is it true for them? 461 00:31:11,650 --> 00:31:12,750 How are they identifing? 462 00:31:12,750 --> 00:31:14,050 And what way is that true? 463 00:31:14,050 --> 00:31:17,150 So notice that just in stopping to ask that question. 464 00:31:17,150 --> 00:31:22,650 There's a question that I need answered that I have to figure out how 465 00:31:22,650 --> 00:31:27,250 to answer and that to wait and see does the psalmist answer it 466 00:31:27,250 --> 00:31:30,850 or does he not answer it you just time making this claim. 467 00:31:30,850 --> 00:31:31,750 Okay. 468 00:31:31,750 --> 00:31:39,850 So right there notice how much kind of meditative thought and and 469 00:31:41,650 --> 00:31:44,550 conversation has gone into that single line. 470 00:31:44,550 --> 00:31:55,150 He continues. You could spend a week just meditating. You could spend a week. So notice how I have to slow down my reading which is against all 471 00:31:55,150 --> 00:31:55,850 of our principals. 472 00:31:55,850 --> 00:32:00,950 So often in pastoral Ministry, we train pastors to use a text to 473 00:32:00,950 --> 00:32:06,950 preach to someone else or to teach someone else or to dig a nugget of 474 00:32:06,950 --> 00:32:12,250 truth and presented for someone else. Meditation involves letting God 475 00:32:12,250 --> 00:32:15,850 speak to you and influence you and I you're the homeltician, but I 476 00:32:15,850 --> 00:32:19,250 always tell my students if you really want to preach an authentic sermon. 477 00:32:19,250 --> 00:32:20,650 What does that mean? 478 00:32:21,550 --> 00:32:26,150 It means I think that that the text has to influence you before you 479 00:32:26,150 --> 00:32:29,350 can speak so that it influence other people. If the text doesn't 480 00:32:29,350 --> 00:32:35,950 influence you it's much harder to preach an authentic sermon. If your preaching for Fred in the pew, 481 00:32:35,950 --> 00:32:39,250 but the text doesn't touch you and your whole study of it the whole 482 00:32:39,250 --> 00:32:39,750 week. 483 00:32:39,750 --> 00:32:48,450 What does that say about you see? Your right. And so often that's how we approach the use of the Psalm. So 484 00:32:48,450 --> 00:32:52,150 meditation I look at it as a distinctive practice that's different 485 00:32:52,150 --> 00:32:54,850 than preparing a sermon different than preparing the Bible. 486 00:32:54,850 --> 00:32:57,950 So he goes very present help in trouble, King James. 487 00:32:57,950 --> 00:33:02,550 Therefore. Therefore. That's a big jump then. That's a huge jump. 488 00:33:02,550 --> 00:33:03,450 Therefore 489 00:33:03,450 --> 00:33:05,150 we will not fear. Notice 490 00:33:05,150 --> 00:33:10,650 how logical he is. Therefore is a lot is another formal feature of 491 00:33:10,650 --> 00:33:13,650 texts that we use were coming to logical conclusions. 492 00:33:13,650 --> 00:33:16,650 Right? When you want to make an argument in a paper you always 493 00:33:16,650 --> 00:33:21,350 read therefore it's very kind of unemotional logical, 494 00:33:21,450 --> 00:33:28,150 reasonable. But it's funny that he uses logic to combat fear. 495 00:33:28,150 --> 00:33:33,150 What's the problem with that? Fear doesn't know logic, right. Have you ever tried to 496 00:33:33,150 --> 00:33:36,040 convince your three-year-old kid to jump into the swimming pool that 497 00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:36,950 you'll catch them. 498 00:33:36,950 --> 00:33:37,850 Don't be afraid. 499 00:33:37,850 --> 00:33:41,850 You can give every logical reason in the world they are not going to do it. 500 00:33:41,850 --> 00:33:43,950 Their fear overcomes it, right? 501 00:33:43,950 --> 00:33:48,850 So you see it becomes it it becomes to me here is giving us a pep 502 00:33:48,850 --> 00:33:50,350 talk almost right? 503 00:33:50,350 --> 00:33:53,950 Why is it so you have to ask why? 504 00:33:55,250 --> 00:33:59,350 If I take this seriously, therefore we will not fear because God is a 505 00:33:59,350 --> 00:34:03,350 very present help but I'm not sure where God is. Notice that says 506 00:34:03,350 --> 00:34:07,750 something about my faith. How hard it is for us to really trust. It's 507 00:34:07,750 --> 00:34:13,250 even hard for a kid to trust their loving mother or father in those 508 00:34:13,250 --> 00:34:13,550 moments. 509 00:34:13,550 --> 00:34:19,650 You see how fear can just take over and so there's a lot of thoughts 510 00:34:19,650 --> 00:34:23,250 going on in my mind just the way that the speaker of this Psalm 511 00:34:23,250 --> 00:34:29,850 presents these assertions in in this kind of logical and so therefore 512 00:34:29,850 --> 00:34:32,850 we will not fear is the worst possible scenarios. 513 00:34:32,850 --> 00:34:38,750 He piles on. He piles on. When the Earth moves when the mountains totter 514 00:34:38,750 --> 00:34:42,650 into the heart of the sea. you see, we won't fear even in the worst of 515 00:34:42,650 --> 00:34:46,950 circumstances. He says this a very logical kind of unassailable truth. 516 00:34:47,950 --> 00:34:49,550 Is it that way for me really? 517 00:34:49,550 --> 00:34:54,750 If so, why or why not those are kind of the way I start to get into 518 00:34:54,750 --> 00:34:57,950 the Psalm. Notice that there's another interesting feature of that. 519 00:34:57,950 --> 00:34:59,750 I asked my students 520 00:34:59,750 --> 00:35:04,650 I'll ask you. When he says therefore we will not fear the language when 521 00:35:04,650 --> 00:35:07,950 the Earth changes when the mountains topple into the heart of the sea, Is 522 00:35:07,950 --> 00:35:12,050 that referring to a literal events or metaphor, 523 00:35:12,050 --> 00:35:15,950 is it a metaphor? Isaiah's filled with a lot of metaphors. 524 00:35:15,950 --> 00:35:19,750 So, how do you say have you taken it in your reading? Figurative. As what? 525 00:35:21,950 --> 00:35:23,150 Things are really bad. 526 00:35:23,150 --> 00:35:23,450 Okay. 527 00:35:23,450 --> 00:35:28,650 So notice that one way to understand this is to interpret it as a metaphor. 528 00:35:28,650 --> 00:35:36,250 If so, then it becomes a metaphor for the troubles distresses, the 529 00:35:36,250 --> 00:35:39,850 terrible things that happened in people's lives and we still use that 530 00:35:39,850 --> 00:35:40,950 language today, right? 531 00:35:40,950 --> 00:35:48,250 My world is crumbling around me, kind of very similar language. So you can take 532 00:35:48,250 --> 00:35:52,550 it as a metaphor and you hooked it right to passages in Isaiah that 533 00:35:52,550 --> 00:35:55,550 uses the same kind of language and the same kind of language 534 00:35:55,550 --> 00:35:57,550 we all just still in our life today. 535 00:35:57,550 --> 00:36:01,650 You could also take it as a more literal description of the undoing of 536 00:36:01,650 --> 00:36:08,650 creation that happens, you know, preliminary in physical events, 537 00:36:08,650 --> 00:36:11,850 like hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes those kind of things. But also 538 00:36:11,850 --> 00:36:15,850 eschatologically at the end of time if you hook it to passages of 539 00:36:15,850 --> 00:36:20,850 scripture in which the very heavens and the Earth are going to be 540 00:36:20,850 --> 00:36:21,350 undone. 541 00:36:22,150 --> 00:36:26,450 Then he could be moving our eyesight our perspective even to that 542 00:36:26,450 --> 00:36:27,950 event. In my experience 543 00:36:29,450 --> 00:36:32,450 children are often worried about asteroid striking the Earth. 544 00:36:32,450 --> 00:36:41,850 There you go. So there you go. So here is what I love about thinking of the line 545 00:36:41,850 --> 00:36:45,550 this way is that you don't have to figure out the right answer. 546 00:36:45,550 --> 00:36:48,550 You don't have to tie that verse to a chair and beat it over the head 547 00:36:48,550 --> 00:36:53,450 to figure it out because both are true within the way we as Christians 548 00:36:53,450 --> 00:36:57,450 live our lives and think about our relationship to God and our 549 00:36:57,450 --> 00:37:02,350 relationship to each other. And in fact the troubles and events that 550 00:37:02,350 --> 00:37:06,250 come our way are in a sense fore taste of the final judgment that 551 00:37:06,250 --> 00:37:06,650 happen. 552 00:37:06,650 --> 00:37:10,350 They're not unconnected you have those connections. 553 00:37:10,350 --> 00:37:16,150 So the great thing about seeing a line as ambiguous that way is not 554 00:37:16,150 --> 00:37:19,950 that it's two contradictory truths, but you see how the truths are 555 00:37:19,950 --> 00:37:23,150 connected and you hold both truce together in a single vision. 556 00:37:23,850 --> 00:37:29,950 And you see then how the theological perspective on troubles that we 557 00:37:29,950 --> 00:37:33,050 may be facing our that trouble we may be facing has a kind of a 558 00:37:33,050 --> 00:37:38,150 theological significance. So verse one is Gospel. 559 00:37:38,150 --> 00:37:39,550 God is our refuge and strength. 560 00:37:40,750 --> 00:37:46,150 But then then it brings up a lot of law. It starts to be the situation and 561 00:37:46,150 --> 00:37:51,950 which often happens. Which is the law working on us. So does the Gospel 562 00:37:51,950 --> 00:37:54,350 come up some more? So very good. 563 00:37:54,350 --> 00:37:58,850 So yeah, as you said earlier he piles on he not only stops at that 564 00:37:58,850 --> 00:37:59,250 line. 565 00:37:59,250 --> 00:38:03,750 He kind of throws caution to the winds. Let its waters roar let them 566 00:38:03,750 --> 00:38:08,350 foam let the mountains shake and it's swelling. As if he throws the 567 00:38:08,350 --> 00:38:12,650 doors open to hey, whatever come what may I'm not going to be afraid. 568 00:38:12,650 --> 00:38:16,450 That's a daunting description 569 00:38:16,450 --> 00:38:20,150 that doesn't describe me. You see so right away. 570 00:38:20,150 --> 00:38:24,450 So you see the identity question if I had asked you of course identify with 571 00:38:24,450 --> 00:38:29,350 the Psalm. But when you get a little closer so you know what I'm having trouble 572 00:38:29,350 --> 00:38:30,850 buying into what the speaker said. 573 00:38:30,850 --> 00:38:31,550 And that's okay. 574 00:38:31,550 --> 00:38:33,650 Ask yourself. 575 00:38:33,650 --> 00:38:33,950 Okay. 576 00:38:33,950 --> 00:38:35,850 I'm not in this place. 577 00:38:35,850 --> 00:38:37,450 What do I do about that? 578 00:38:37,450 --> 00:38:40,050 Where do I find comfort or 579 00:38:40,050 --> 00:38:40,450 hope? 580 00:38:40,750 --> 00:38:45,550 That particular line ends with the obscure Hebrew word Sela which 581 00:38:45,550 --> 00:38:48,350 sometimes some people think it means a musical interlude. 582 00:38:48,350 --> 00:38:52,050 Some people think it might mean that line is emphasized some 583 00:38:52,050 --> 00:38:57,050 think it might just mean it gives you a time for silence. 584 00:38:57,050 --> 00:39:00,950 What I want to point out is what happens in the next couple verses 585 00:39:00,950 --> 00:39:03,850 which I think is in the pivot of the Psalm. 586 00:39:03,850 --> 00:39:04,950 Alright. 587 00:39:04,950 --> 00:39:12,650 So again, the last lines notice the language of it now notice the next 588 00:39:12,650 --> 00:39:18,950 verse. A river gets streams gladden the city of God. So the first of all 589 00:39:18,950 --> 00:39:22,450 when I see gladden the city of God, I'm thinking that's a metonymy for 590 00:39:22,450 --> 00:39:25,750 the people in the city. Just like we said the White House announced 591 00:39:25,750 --> 00:39:28,650 today was that actually the house that has a mouth. 592 00:39:28,650 --> 00:39:31,050 We mean the person who lives in the house. 593 00:39:31,050 --> 00:39:36,150 So the same thing here a river it's streams gladden the City of God 594 00:39:36,150 --> 00:39:39,850 the holy place of the Tabernacles of the most high. 595 00:39:40,750 --> 00:39:53,250 Is it strange that all of a sudden the river pops up. Okay, very good. So see your a perceptive reader. First of all when I ask you. I been hanging around you for 20 some years. 596 00:39:53,250 --> 00:39:54,150 What the city of God as a reference to? Zion. 597 00:39:54,150 --> 00:39:56,050 Okay, Zion Jerusalem right away. 598 00:39:56,050 --> 00:39:59,450 Why because we're hooking it to the larger story of the Old Testament. 599 00:39:59,450 --> 00:40:00,850 That's the city of God. 600 00:40:00,850 --> 00:40:02,650 Why is it called the city of God? 601 00:40:02,650 --> 00:40:04,450 Cuz that's where God put his name. 602 00:40:04,450 --> 00:40:08,850 That's where God promised to be with his people above the mercy seat in 603 00:40:08,850 --> 00:40:11,850 the sanctuary. Right? Even in David's time 604 00:40:11,850 --> 00:40:17,450 he stretched the tent out and made a place for the Ark and of course 605 00:40:17,450 --> 00:40:20,150 Solomon build his Temple there on Zion. 606 00:40:20,150 --> 00:40:20,750 Alright. 607 00:40:21,950 --> 00:40:29,350 Notice the shift this becomes quite noticeable the shift in emotion 608 00:40:29,350 --> 00:40:35,550 between the first four verses and this part of the Psalm. If I would 609 00:40:35,550 --> 00:40:38,850 describe the first section of the Psalm, I would say it's filled with 610 00:40:38,850 --> 00:40:45,150 noise the crashing of waves the tottering of mountains into the Seas. 611 00:40:45,150 --> 00:40:50,350 The Roaring boiling of the waters the swelling you see the noise the 612 00:40:50,350 --> 00:40:56,550 crash the din of the waters of the seas. Right away in that gap between 613 00:40:56,550 --> 00:41:00,550 the first part of the Psalm and this part of the Psalm there's a shift 614 00:41:00,550 --> 00:41:01,950 and you get a river. 615 00:41:02,950 --> 00:41:06,250 All of a sudden people notice this all time 616 00:41:06,250 --> 00:41:10,050 when I point out your you your right this sense of calm has come 617 00:41:10,050 --> 00:41:13,550 over me and I think that's intentional see that we need to capture in 618 00:41:13,550 --> 00:41:13,950 the Psalm. 619 00:41:13,950 --> 00:41:18,850 It's affective intention of the author. Do you know what pops into my head. 620 00:41:18,850 --> 00:41:23,650 Horatio Spafford's hymn. When peace like a river attendeth my way. When 621 00:41:23,650 --> 00:41:28,350 sorrows like storm billows roll. See the contrast. 622 00:41:28,350 --> 00:41:33,350 Yeah see and so a lot of times Psalm shifted emotions like that and 623 00:41:33,350 --> 00:41:37,250 it's not so much what the song means with how it means that you need 624 00:41:37,250 --> 00:41:41,650 to pay attention to the ship and see if it shifts back because there's 625 00:41:41,650 --> 00:41:46,350 huge meaning in there. And that's where people find the affect of a 626 00:41:46,350 --> 00:41:50,950 relational aspect of the Psalms in these kinds of things. 627 00:41:50,950 --> 00:42:00,750 So you go from anxiety and fear, noise, uncertainty to peace, calm a 628 00:42:00,750 --> 00:42:02,450 river. It streams 629 00:42:02,850 --> 00:42:07,950 gladden the city of God. Now notice how river connects us all kinds of 630 00:42:07,950 --> 00:42:12,050 scripture because water and a life-giving force of water in the 631 00:42:12,050 --> 00:42:18,250 promises of water permeate the narratives of God's people in both 632 00:42:18,250 --> 00:42:19,950 the Wilderness in both Testaments. 633 00:42:19,950 --> 00:42:23,650 There's a reason Jesus calls himself the Water of Life right. Who 634 00:42:23,650 --> 00:42:24,650 drinks of me will never thirst 635 00:42:24,650 --> 00:42:24,840 again. 636 00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:33,250 We have verse after verse text after text that make use of those kinds 637 00:42:33,250 --> 00:42:37,350 of images but also actual events got struck the rock and water came 638 00:42:37,350 --> 00:42:38,050 out of it, see. 639 00:42:38,050 --> 00:42:40,250 So now I'm reading this devotionally. 640 00:42:41,750 --> 00:42:45,550 And and I lean back and I just start making those associations. 641 00:42:45,550 --> 00:42:49,950 Exegetically maybe their proper 642 00:42:49,950 --> 00:42:54,450 maybe there are stretch but they're still all from the Word. 643 00:42:54,450 --> 00:42:57,650 Yes. Yes, so. And Jesus is being impressed upon my soul. 644 00:42:57,650 --> 00:42:58,350 That's right. 645 00:42:58,350 --> 00:42:59,250 And so 646 00:43:01,050 --> 00:43:04,550 sometimes we were so much about being right or wrong. 647 00:43:04,550 --> 00:43:09,550 We think about reading scripture in those categories that what happens 648 00:43:09,550 --> 00:43:13,750 is especially if you're quotes professional student Bible you'll read a text 649 00:43:13,750 --> 00:43:14,250 and then right away 650 00:43:14,250 --> 00:43:17,750 you'll start going to the secondary literature to check to see what the 651 00:43:17,750 --> 00:43:19,350 right. And then pretty soon 652 00:43:19,350 --> 00:43:21,750 you're more occupied with the secondary literature rather than the 653 00:43:21,750 --> 00:43:25,750 primary. But if you just met with the text notice when we're in 654 00:43:25,750 --> 00:43:31,750 conversations, am I right or wrong doesn't come up as much as more 655 00:43:31,750 --> 00:43:37,250 relational affective questions more interpretive questions that kind 656 00:43:37,250 --> 00:43:37,550 of thing. 657 00:43:37,550 --> 00:43:39,050 We don't tend to think in those categories 658 00:43:39,050 --> 00:43:43,050 so rigidly, but so many people are afraid to read scriptures cuz 659 00:43:43,050 --> 00:43:44,650 they're worried about getting it wrong. 660 00:43:44,650 --> 00:43:47,650 So you need a professional to get it right. 661 00:43:47,650 --> 00:43:50,950 There's something to be said for that. 662 00:43:50,950 --> 00:43:56,750 But the way I always relieve anxiety of people is to say look it's 663 00:43:56,750 --> 00:44:00,350 important that you read scripture in community with other people. 664 00:44:00,950 --> 00:44:05,650 So that you can begin to have conversations with them around what the 665 00:44:05,650 --> 00:44:12,150 Word is giving you and be open to correction be open to incite. Luther, 666 00:44:12,150 --> 00:44:16,550 you know suggest that we always read scripture humbly realizing 667 00:44:16,550 --> 00:44:19,950 someone else may see something that I don't see someone else may see 668 00:44:19,950 --> 00:44:23,950 something later that I didn't get. So know. That kind of 669 00:44:23,950 --> 00:44:30,550 back-and-forth. You showed us the mood change now we got the peaceful river. Peace like 670 00:44:30,550 --> 00:44:32,150 a river attendeth my way. 671 00:44:33,250 --> 00:44:43,850 What are the results? He glads us. What else? So notice the next line. God is in her midst she will not be moved. 672 00:44:43,850 --> 00:44:47,250 God will help her at the break of day. 673 00:44:47,250 --> 00:44:52,050 So notice that the psalmist raised this question for me. 674 00:44:52,050 --> 00:44:58,450 Where is God in the midst of troubles the Psalm starts to give an 675 00:44:58,450 --> 00:45:04,350 answer here in these verses when he says God is in his City. 676 00:45:04,350 --> 00:45:11,050 Okay. And is in the city, but all the sudden this sense of calm and 677 00:45:11,050 --> 00:45:14,350 peace starts to pervade the psalmist and the Psalm. 678 00:45:15,150 --> 00:45:20,050 And notice what he says when he says God is in her midst she won't be 679 00:45:20,050 --> 00:45:20,550 moved. 680 00:45:20,550 --> 00:45:24,550 Well that word for moved is the same word that's used in the previous 681 00:45:24,550 --> 00:45:27,650 section to talk about the tottering of the mountains Into the heart of 682 00:45:27,650 --> 00:45:30,450 the sea, see. So everything maybe falling apart 683 00:45:31,550 --> 00:45:37,350 but in her midst this place where God has put his name where he is in 684 00:45:37,350 --> 00:45:39,050 its midst won't be moved. 685 00:45:39,050 --> 00:45:39,650 That's the church. 686 00:45:39,650 --> 00:45:40,150 Correct. 687 00:45:40,150 --> 00:45:44,850 So eventually it's springs out to as the New Testament begins to look 688 00:45:44,850 --> 00:45:51,150 at it the Church around which or in which God promised to be present 689 00:45:51,150 --> 00:45:55,350 in his Word and the sacraments. Where two or three are gathered in my name 690 00:45:55,350 --> 00:45:55,550 there 691 00:45:55,550 --> 00:45:58,050 am I in the midst of them. Where there we hear the promises of God. 692 00:45:58,050 --> 00:46:04,350 So again, we hook it to the larger story first the Old Testament and 693 00:46:04,350 --> 00:46:09,050 the theological significance of the sanctuary through Jesus who is 694 00:46:09,050 --> 00:46:11,850 Israel condensed into one who says himself destroy this Temple 695 00:46:11,850 --> 00:46:15,050 and in three days, I will raise it more Gods really present with his 696 00:46:15,050 --> 00:46:15,250 people. 697 00:46:15,250 --> 00:46:20,850 There's a reason that John fashions his language like that to the Church 698 00:46:20,850 --> 00:46:23,950 the New Jerusalem. And I'm sitting here. In the present time and in the future of 699 00:46:23,950 --> 00:46:24,950 revelation. Excuse me I'm sitting here and trying to meditate and a hymn pops into my mind. 700 00:46:31,450 --> 00:46:35,650 The church shall never perish. Yeah. For dear Lord to defend to the guide to 701 00:46:35,650 --> 00:46:40,050 sustains and cherishes with her to the end. So that the because God is in 702 00:46:40,050 --> 00:46:46,250 the midst of her, the Church, our faith will never perish. See that's 703 00:46:46,250 --> 00:46:50,050 where okay, where is God present for us in troubles? 704 00:46:50,050 --> 00:46:54,250 Ultimately he's present in this word made flesh in the promises of God 705 00:46:54,250 --> 00:46:59,150 that the church proclaims. And that takes us from the past from the Old 706 00:46:59,150 --> 00:47:03,950 Testament to Jesus himself to the Church of the New Testament to the 707 00:47:03,950 --> 00:47:07,250 Church of the eschaton which is pictured as what the New Jerusalem 708 00:47:07,250 --> 00:47:12,050 coming down from heaven in which the Lamb of God is in it's midst. 709 00:47:12,050 --> 00:47:15,950 So much of our hymnody and you've been quoting a lot of hymns and I 710 00:47:15,950 --> 00:47:20,250 know you know those so well take these images with scripture you see. 711 00:47:20,250 --> 00:47:21,550 And 712 00:47:22,250 --> 00:47:26,550 we don't even consciously interpret them because they're so much a 713 00:47:26,550 --> 00:47:27,350 part of our story. 714 00:47:27,350 --> 00:47:30,650 But when you do you find out how the hymns are hooking us back up to 715 00:47:30,650 --> 00:47:36,050 the larger story even in the Old Testament language that we now begin 716 00:47:36,050 --> 00:47:38,050 to see and understand in the light of Jesus. 717 00:47:38,050 --> 00:47:43,950 And so what happens in this part of the Psalm the hinge of the Psalm 718 00:47:44,950 --> 00:47:48,650 is it reverses the language of the previous part. 719 00:47:48,650 --> 00:47:50,250 So where the mountains totter 720 00:47:50,250 --> 00:47:54,950 you know, everything is in turmoil. In the city of God where God is 721 00:47:54,950 --> 00:47:55,150 present 722 00:47:55,150 --> 00:48:01,650 they won't be moved. And then he says God will help her. Notice in verse 1 723 00:48:01,650 --> 00:48:08,950 he's a present help so it picks up the same word and shows us where 724 00:48:08,950 --> 00:48:10,250 help is to be found. 725 00:48:10,250 --> 00:48:14,750 And then you have that issue phrase at the break of day at the turn of 726 00:48:14,750 --> 00:48:15,350 the morning. 727 00:48:15,350 --> 00:48:21,850 The only other place where the exact phrases found is in Exodus 14 at 728 00:48:21,850 --> 00:48:22,950 the waters of the Red Sea. 729 00:48:22,950 --> 00:48:28,050 Where at the break of day God delivered his people through the Red 730 00:48:28,050 --> 00:48:28,350 Sea. 731 00:48:28,350 --> 00:48:30,950 Is it fair to read into that, 732 00:48:30,950 --> 00:48:31,850 okay, 733 00:48:31,850 --> 00:48:35,450 God does not seem to be with me now and in my problem. 734 00:48:36,050 --> 00:48:40,650 But he is here and he soon will act on my behalf. Yes, and so notice that when I asked that question. Where is God present in trouble? 735 00:48:49,350 --> 00:48:52,850 The only place we find comfort is where he has revealed himself for 736 00:48:52,850 --> 00:48:57,350 his put his name and that's in the promises of our Lord and Savior, 737 00:48:57,350 --> 00:49:00,350 even when all visible signs seem to have disappeared. 738 00:49:00,350 --> 00:49:05,650 Even when life is falling apart. When every Earthly prop gives way. 739 00:49:05,650 --> 00:49:15,650 He then is all my hope and stay. And that's all we have to cling to. And it is through that very message that the Holy Spirit comforts our hearts and sometimes mysterious 740 00:49:15,650 --> 00:49:17,650 and unbelievable ways. 741 00:49:17,650 --> 00:49:22,350 But you see that time and time again and people in times of greatest 742 00:49:22,350 --> 00:49:27,850 hardships, they find comfort and solace in this message of Hope and 743 00:49:27,850 --> 00:49:31,850 promise. And what do we do as God's people we should be a community 744 00:49:31,850 --> 00:49:36,950 that welcomes those who are hurting welcomes those who are afraid and 745 00:49:36,950 --> 00:49:41,850 brings them the solace of the Gospel and that's where we find God is a 746 00:49:41,850 --> 00:49:43,650 help in miraculous ways. 747 00:49:43,650 --> 00:49:48,350 Maybe not even visible to us now, but again, that's the hope the life 748 00:49:48,350 --> 00:49:49,250 of faith that we lead. 749 00:49:49,550 --> 00:49:50,350 You know, I 750 00:49:51,850 --> 00:49:56,250 I would like to ask the producer if we could keep going on for an hour 751 00:49:56,250 --> 00:50:01,850 or two or three because it's this is fascinating at at at a devotional 752 00:50:01,850 --> 00:50:07,350 level personally, but but for me also professionally, you know. Right. 753 00:50:07,350 --> 00:50:13,250 Boy, there's a lot of lot of a lot of stuff here that will preach but 754 00:50:13,250 --> 00:50:17,650 we're going to have to stop it. But my producer said we can't do that that. I want to thank 755 00:50:17,650 --> 00:50:17,950 you 756 00:50:17,950 --> 00:50:18,250 Dr. 757 00:50:18,250 --> 00:50:19,550 Saleska for being with us. 758 00:50:19,550 --> 00:50:23,250 And I thank you our audience for joining us. 759 00:50:23,250 --> 00:50:24,750 I'm Dale Meyer. 760 00:50:24,750 --> 00:50:30,950 This has been Word and Work an Intersection and may the Psalms bless the 761 00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:33,650 intersection of Word and Work in your life.