WEBVTT

1
00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:04.600
Nothing, huh?

2
00:00:04.600 --> 00:00:05.600
Okay.

3
00:00:07.400 --> 00:00:10.200
Maybe the auditorium is empty and no one's even there for all

4
00:00:10.200 --> 00:00:14.200
I know I'm just talking to the screen. Green light on top of my

5
00:00:14.200 --> 00:00:14.600
computer.

6
00:00:17.100 --> 00:00:17.600
All right.

7
00:00:17.600 --> 00:00:18.000
Good.

8
00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:19.100
No questions from Bryan.

9
00:00:19.100 --> 00:00:19.900
That's fine.

10
00:00:19.900 --> 00:00:26.400
Alright you guys are all quit contentedly seating there. Alright, let me wrap up this section then

11
00:00:26.400 --> 00:00:28.000
before we take our break.

12
00:00:28.000 --> 00:00:33.300
I just talking about this whole idea of rights and flesh this out a little bit more.

13
00:00:33.300 --> 00:00:37.500
And usually I get a fair amount of push back on this but you guys are being quite compliant today.

14
00:00:37.500 --> 00:00:43.900
Maybe it's that host lunch on reality blissfully happy enjoying the

15
00:00:43.900 --> 00:00:48.600
time to sit comfortably there in Werner. So the idea of rights.

16
00:00:50.100 --> 00:00:54.400
America's premised on the rights of the individual this goes back to

17
00:00:54.400 --> 00:00:54.900
the Enlightenment.

18
00:00:54.900 --> 00:00:58.200
This is one of the things that was Jefferson was stressing like crazy

19
00:00:58.200 --> 00:01:02.500
in this Declaration of Independence, which he penned that all

20
00:01:02.500 --> 00:01:05.600
men have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is the

21
00:01:05.600 --> 00:01:11.100
basic tenets of the of the Enlightenment. And it shows up all over the

22
00:01:11.100 --> 00:01:12.600
place in our founding documents.

23
00:01:12.600 --> 00:01:17.400
So the way that America is grounded is that the individual has these

24
00:01:17.400 --> 00:01:20.200
inherent rights may be given by a Creator.

25
00:01:20.200 --> 00:01:22.400
That's how most of them talks back in the 18 century.

26
00:01:22.400 --> 00:01:23.800
They were still deist at that point.

27
00:01:23.800 --> 00:01:30.300
So we have these rights that came from somewhere and these are inherent rights as an individual and I yield some of

28
00:01:30.300 --> 00:01:34.400
those rights to the state for the sake of being able to get along with

29
00:01:34.400 --> 00:01:34.600
one another.

30
00:01:34.600 --> 00:01:40.200
So the old adage your right to swing your fist ends at the end of my

31
00:01:40.200 --> 00:01:41.400
nose. Okay cute.

32
00:01:41.400 --> 00:01:45.200
So we've got to be able to justify and reconcile competing rights that

33
00:01:45.200 --> 00:01:45.900
what government's do.

34
00:01:45.900 --> 00:01:48.900
We all have our rights and the government sorts those things out.

35
00:01:49.300 --> 00:01:53.100
So that's how everything works in America. And America is founded

36
00:01:53.100 --> 00:01:57.600
absolutely premised on this idea of rights, rights, rights, rights, rights,

37
00:01:57.600 --> 00:02:01.600
rights and every things about my rights. Right to free speech, right to worship

38
00:02:01.600 --> 00:02:05.100
right to carry a gun, right to assemble, rights, rights, rights, rights,

39
00:02:05.100 --> 00:02:09.000
rights. First ten amendments all about my rights. So we're all about

40
00:02:09.000 --> 00:02:12.000
rights and even Christians start talking this way. I have a right to

41
00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:17.300
worship God. I have a right to go to the church of my choice. I have a

42
00:02:17.300 --> 00:02:23.300
right to not have to have my church taxed because that would be

43
00:02:23.300 --> 00:02:27.900
confusing a church and state or something and so they have all these ideas of

44
00:02:27.900 --> 00:02:29.100
their inherent rights.

45
00:02:29.500 --> 00:02:34.200
So the question I have is this. Where in scripture is the grounding for

46
00:02:34.200 --> 00:02:35.200
this talk of rights?

47
00:02:35.200 --> 00:02:37.000
Where's the foundation?

48
00:02:37.000 --> 00:02:39.600
Where do you see rights being asserted?

49
00:02:39.600 --> 00:02:42.300
So where does God ever say to Adam, hey Adam

50
00:02:42.300 --> 00:02:44.900
I'm making you a human you not have the right to life.

51
00:02:44.900 --> 00:02:46.800
You have the right to food.

52
00:02:46.800 --> 00:02:49.000
You have the right to clean water

53
00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:51.500
and air. You have the right to an occupation.

54
00:02:51.500 --> 00:02:54.700
You have the right to sexuality as you please. You have the right to

55
00:02:54.700 --> 00:02:55.200
healthcare.

56
00:02:55.200 --> 00:02:57.000
You have the right to a long life.

57
00:02:57.000 --> 00:03:01.000
You have the right to live where you want.

58
00:03:01.000 --> 00:03:05.400
Where, where, where does God give Adam a list of rights?

59
00:03:05.400 --> 00:03:08.200
What does God give Adam even in one right?

60
00:03:08.200 --> 00:03:10.400
He gives Adam responsibilities. He gives him task to do. Be fruitful and multiply, fill the Earth. Have dominion over it. Care for it, watch over it. Lead it guide it.

61
00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:20.100
He gives Adam work to do.  Rights? No there not there. There is no talk of

62
00:03:20.100 --> 00:03:21.100
rights.

63
00:03:21.600 --> 00:03:22.500
No, they're not

64
00:03:22.500 --> 00:03:25.000
there. There is no talk of rights.

65
00:03:25.000 --> 00:03:27.600
And only time you ever going to get rights being talked about in the

66
00:03:27.600 --> 00:03:32.000
Bible is where Paul invokes his right as a Roman citizen to have a

67
00:03:32.000 --> 00:03:36.700
trial before Caesar. Which I would argue is Paul being very sharp and being

68
00:03:36.700 --> 00:03:41.100
smart as serpents and using his privilege to get a free ticket

69
00:03:41.100 --> 00:03:43.900
to Rome. Because he was wanting to go to Rome anyway, and he knows it's

70
00:03:43.900 --> 00:03:44.700
good for the Gospel.

71
00:03:44.700 --> 00:03:49.500
So he uses his right for that purpose. Now, I'll come back to the idea of

72
00:03:49.500 --> 00:03:51.200
using the rights given to us here in a minute.

73
00:03:51.200 --> 00:03:57.700
But the premise then is Christians do not have rights.

74
00:03:57.700 --> 00:03:58.000
Don't work that way.

75
00:03:58.000 --> 00:04:01.500
We don't operate with the notion of my inherent rights.

76
00:04:01.500 --> 00:04:05.600
We don't talk that way that way we don't claim rights.

77
00:04:05.600 --> 00:04:07.600
I don't have a list of inherent right.

78
00:04:07.600 --> 00:04:15.700
I don't have some god-given inborn right to life or Liberty or pursuit

79
00:04:15.700 --> 00:04:16.300
of happiness.

80
00:04:16.300 --> 00:04:18.000
I don't have a right to anything.

81
00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:19.500
I'm just given gifts.

82
00:04:19.500 --> 00:04:21.300
This is how Christianity works.

83
00:04:21.600 --> 00:04:25.600
You have everything you have by the grace of God. God calls you,

84
00:04:25.600 --> 00:04:29.600
enlightens you with the Gospel gives you his gifts he gives you the

85
00:04:29.600 --> 00:04:30.100
gift of life.

86
00:04:30.100 --> 00:04:31.900
He gives you to get to Salvation.

87
00:04:31.900 --> 00:04:35.500
He gives you the gift of promise of the Resurrection reality.

88
00:04:35.500 --> 00:04:47.300
He gives you gift after gift you don't deserve them. You don't have a right to them. It's called grace. It's called mercy. THat's how Chrisitnaity works. No creature walks into the presence of

89
00:04:47.300 --> 00:04:49.700
God and asserts his rights. Oh God

90
00:04:49.700 --> 00:04:51.600
I have a right to eternal life.

91
00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:55.200
I have a right to be treated fairly here and for you to send me to

92
00:04:55.200 --> 00:05:00.400
hell is not fair. This is absurd. No. No creature ever starts talking about rights before

93
00:05:00.400 --> 00:05:00.700
God.

94
00:05:00.700 --> 00:05:02.500
We don't have rights

95
00:05:02.500 --> 00:05:03.000
inherently.

96
00:05:03.000 --> 00:05:07.600
We have gifts given to us by God, which we are tasked to use

97
00:05:07.600 --> 00:05:08.900
for the sake of those around us.

98
00:05:08.900 --> 00:05:09.400
So

99
00:05:10.300 --> 00:05:18.500
at its very foundational core understanding reality and anthropology

100
00:05:18.500 --> 00:05:23.500
and human purpose Christianity and the American Constitution are

101
00:05:23.500 --> 00:05:29.700
completely at odds. They are not compatible. Completely at odds with each

102
00:05:29.700 --> 00:05:30.100
other.

103
00:05:30.100 --> 00:05:33.100
The one is premised on individual rights and the enhancement of the

104
00:05:33.100 --> 00:05:37.700
individual. The other one is premised on the gift that God gives incorporating me

105
00:05:37.700 --> 00:05:41.500
into his story and allowing me to live as his creature rightly related

106
00:05:41.500 --> 00:05:44.300
to him and to those around me are completely different stories, completely different narratives.

107
00:05:44.300 --> 00:05:47.300
That's what Hauserwas was getting at. That's what Bonhoeffer was getting at.

108
00:05:47.300 --> 00:05:50.100
So we don't claim rights.

109
00:05:50.100 --> 00:05:54.200
So that means the Church has to think very hard about how much she

110
00:05:54.200 --> 00:05:56.300
uses the rights that she's been given.

111
00:05:56.300 --> 00:06:00.700
So if the government grants me certain rights and our government has

112
00:06:00.700 --> 00:06:05.500
which I'm grateful for it makes life more enjoyable more pleasurable.

113
00:06:05.500 --> 00:06:06.900
Not that's better, but that's true

114
00:06:06.900 --> 00:06:10.100
it does. So I have these certain rights and the Church

115
00:06:10.200 --> 00:06:14.000
also enjoys these rights as an institution within the American

116
00:06:14.000 --> 00:06:15.100
reality.

117
00:06:15.100 --> 00:06:18.200
So the Church can of valence off of those rights.

118
00:06:18.200 --> 00:06:21.600
It has the privilege of doing that but should she?

119
00:06:21.600 --> 00:06:23.300
That's what I'm trying to get at here. That's what

120
00:06:23.300 --> 00:06:25.700
I'm trying to challenge a little bit. The Church needs to be careful

121
00:06:25.700 --> 00:06:29.400
not just to say I have a right to go to court to get my fair share or

122
00:06:29.400 --> 00:06:32.600
to be exempt from this law exempt from this or that or they get this

123
00:06:32.600 --> 00:06:34.200
we can do that.

124
00:06:34.200 --> 00:06:37.200
We have to be careful going to be careful that what we're doing is not

125
00:06:37.200 --> 00:06:42.600
to serve ourselves not too kind of safeguard our own morality and our

126
00:06:42.600 --> 00:06:46.000
purity, not to advance our own purpose. We need to do it because we're

127
00:06:46.000 --> 00:06:46.800
trying to witness to

128
00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:56.600
the reality of Christ in the world. That's got to be our purpose. And so it needs to be a great deal of care taken in this idea of asserting our rights as the church as this

129
00:06:56.600 --> 00:06:58.900
institution of the body of Christ at work in the world.

130
00:06:58.900 --> 00:07:01.500
You need to be careful about this.

131
00:07:01.500 --> 00:07:07.100
So that's grounded in this very premise this very idea of this

132
00:07:07.100 --> 00:07:10.100
inherent rights as an individual. Which I would

133
00:07:10.200 --> 00:07:13.800
say doesn't exist and I'll just say it flat-out.

134
00:07:13.800 --> 00:07:17.000
We don't as creatures have these rights.

135
00:07:17.000 --> 00:07:22.100
We have these gifts. So the Church should not be engaging itself in the

136
00:07:22.100 --> 00:07:24.300
defense of rights in this pursuit of rights.

137
00:07:24.300 --> 00:07:27.700
We need to be engaging ourselves in witnessing the reality of Christ

138
00:07:27.700 --> 00:07:31.300
in the world and making that reality known that's rather different. Now

139
00:07:31.300 --> 00:07:31.700
this

140
00:07:32.700 --> 00:07:35.200
premise of rights then is what's underneath

141
00:07:35.200 --> 00:07:36.300
all of the sense

142
00:07:36.300 --> 00:07:39.800
I think of of the American entitlement mentality. You know, I'm an

143
00:07:39.800 --> 00:07:40.400
individual

144
00:07:40.400 --> 00:07:41.400
I'm entitled to this.

145
00:07:41.400 --> 00:07:45.900
I have a right to this. This is how we are taught to think of as Americans. From the time we are little kids all the

146
00:07:45.900 --> 00:07:48.200
way through kindergarten kids know about this everybody knows about

147
00:07:48.200 --> 00:07:48.400
it. We are all rights, rights, rights, rights, rights. And Christians don't function that way.

148
00:07:48.400 --> 00:07:57.000
This is true for what the Church owes the world and it's also true

149
00:07:57.000 --> 00:08:00.200
for us as individuals. And what it means for us as individuals to go

150
00:08:00.200 --> 00:08:02.400
boldly out in the Gods world and function as God's witnesses in the world. And be God's spokesman in the world of God's truth.

151
00:08:02.400 --> 00:08:13.200
Christian individuals are living this as well. So I've been thinking for this last session his last hour 15 was last

152
00:08:13.200 --> 00:08:16.600
hour about the Church owes the world. When we come back from our break

153
00:08:16.600 --> 00:08:20.900
I'm going to zero in on the individual and individual living in the

154
00:08:20.900 --> 00:08:22.000
world and how we do that.

155
00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:25.900
You're going to start with this whole premise of rights and kind of

156
00:08:25.900 --> 00:08:27.000
kaboshing rights.

157
00:08:27.000 --> 00:08:30.500
So if we don't have rights, what does that mean for how I live in the

158
00:08:30.500 --> 00:08:31.500
world and what I do in the world? So we now have a

159
00:08:32.700 --> 00:08:37.200
break coming up. After the break will have only 75 minutes left.

160
00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:39.000
So I'll do some presentation.

161
00:08:39.000 --> 00:08:42.500
Then I want to do some significant time for Q&A at the end.

162
00:08:42.500 --> 00:08:45.000
So this is your time to be thinking about questions getting a typed out and

163
00:08:45.000 --> 00:08:54.100
get those sent into on that flbi2020 at csl.edu one more time flbi

164
00:08:54.100 --> 00:08:58.400
2020 at csl.edu or just raise your hand and Brian

165
00:08:58.400 --> 00:09:02.100
will ask your question to me and we'll get these questions dealt with. And

166
00:09:02.100 --> 00:09:05.200
I want it answer your questions and I've got a couple of lingering

167
00:09:05.200 --> 00:09:06.400
ones that are still loose up here

168
00:09:06.400 --> 00:09:09.300
I'll get those covered. And we'll deal with other ones do as they come

169
00:09:09.300 --> 00:09:09.400
along.

170
00:09:09.400 --> 00:09:12.800
So we'll take a fifteen-minute break and will get back together again

171
00:09:12.800 --> 00:09:16.800
here at 1:45, and we got 75 minutes left and then we'll be wrapping

172
00:09:16.800 --> 00:09:18.700
this thing up more or less on time.

173
00:09:18.700 --> 00:09:20.200
I see you shortly.

174
00:09:27.200 --> 00:09:32.000
Alright, so I just got the green light ready to go. It's a quarter till right on schedule.

175
00:09:32.000 --> 00:09:42.700
This is beautiful part about this online stuff. I can start when I want to start. The guest don't have anything to say about it. Of course maybe no one is there. And I am talking to an empty auditorium for all I know.

176
00:09:42.700 --> 00:09:44.000
Again this is a little challenging.

177
00:09:44.000 --> 00:09:45.300
My green light is still on.

178
00:09:45.300 --> 00:09:46.100
So I'll keep talking. I will enjoy my conversation even if it is one sided.

179
00:09:50.700 --> 00:09:54.800
So a couple questions have trickled in let me address those and answer

180
00:09:54.800 --> 00:09:57.400
those questions cuz I want to get those taken care of before I forget

181
00:09:57.400 --> 00:09:59.500
and things get away from me.

182
00:09:59.500 --> 00:10:03.000
And then I want to talk a little bit about the individual going out

183
00:10:03.000 --> 00:10:05.500
into the world and what this means and how we live in the world and

184
00:10:05.500 --> 00:10:09.600
just kind of ground that and a couple foundational ideas. And then I want

185
00:10:09.600 --> 00:10:12.000
again field any questions you have. You guys got questions

186
00:10:12.000 --> 00:10:15.200
you need to be asking them. You came to this seminar hoping for some clarity.

187
00:10:15.200 --> 00:10:18.000
I want to give it to you. You have to ask before I can give it to

188
00:10:18.000 --> 00:10:19.500
you. And trust me

189
00:10:19.500 --> 00:10:22.400
I probably got an opinion about anything you want to ask about. And I

190
00:10:22.400 --> 00:10:24.900
might even have some truth about anything you want to ask about. And I

191
00:10:24.900 --> 00:10:27.700
can lay it out for you and I will and I'm not afraid to do that by

192
00:10:27.700 --> 00:10:29.400
just need to know what you are interested in.

193
00:10:29.400 --> 00:10:30.100
So ask your questions.

194
00:10:30.100 --> 00:10:33.800
All right, and we'll see how things progress here then.

195
00:10:33.800 --> 00:10:39.500
So we've got just another hour 15 or so our 14 now so get your questions in

196
00:10:39.500 --> 00:10:42.600
and on yes, you can have my email address.

197
00:10:42.600 --> 00:10:46.200
That's fine is the available the seminary's websites.

198
00:10:46.200 --> 00:10:46.800
No great secret.

199
00:10:46.800 --> 00:10:50.100
So just my last name and first initial at csl.edu.

200
00:10:50.800 --> 00:10:55.500
So biermannj at csl.edu and you can email questions to me. Don't

201
00:10:55.500 --> 00:10:59.000
expect long lengthy answers those take a lot of time but I'll be

202
00:10:59.000 --> 00:11:04.700
happy to know if you answer whatever I can. If you have things you want to go beyond or you want to

203
00:11:04.700 --> 00:11:06.400
ask about your class session.

204
00:11:06.400 --> 00:11:07.400
All right.

205
00:11:07.400 --> 00:11:11.700
So let's press forward. Question.

206
00:11:11.700 --> 00:11:19.100
I want to address this one now is a good of time as any. See you got left leading friends who are claiming it all BLM

207
00:11:19.100 --> 00:11:23.100
supporters and their supporters argue  immigration rights or

208
00:11:23.100 --> 00:11:26.100
whatever else kind of thing, but they do seem to be rather silent

209
00:11:26.100 --> 00:11:26.800
about abortion.

210
00:11:26.800 --> 00:11:29.300
What do you say to those kinds of people and then what do you say to

211
00:11:29.300 --> 00:11:32.200
your other your Christian friend on the other end of things who says,

212
00:11:32.200 --> 00:11:35.400
you know, I want to be so right and there's no Christian candidate.

213
00:11:35.400 --> 00:11:36.400
I'm not going to even vote.

214
00:11:36.400 --> 00:11:40.100
All right that those are good questions. And

215
00:11:41.300 --> 00:11:46.500
that should be dealt with and then we have another question about the

216
00:11:46.500 --> 00:11:50.400
the moment of our liberalism the politics of confused the Christian

217
00:11:50.400 --> 00:11:53.000
about what is right. Political right owns the rights of the unborn

218
00:11:53.000 --> 00:11:55.700
and I have my own answer.

219
00:11:55.700 --> 00:11:58.700
It seems that the government should promote policies that give all

220
00:11:58.700 --> 00:12:01.400
citizens that fair shake. We'll talk about that too.

221
00:12:01.400 --> 00:12:06.700
So let's hit this kind of few basic principles here.

222
00:12:06.700 --> 00:12:10.000
So Luther's writing in a context where the prince is put there by God.

223
00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:11.000
Clearly

224
00:12:11.000 --> 00:12:13.200
he's the one guy in charge and everybody else

225
00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:16.600
is there working with him. But they're just the citizens and their his

226
00:12:16.600 --> 00:12:19.300
subjects and you pay their taxes they pray for him,

227
00:12:19.300 --> 00:12:19.700
that's it.

228
00:12:19.700 --> 00:12:22.400
We're not living in a feudal society anymore.

229
00:12:22.400 --> 00:12:25.600
And we're not living in an Empire like Paul was we're living in a

230
00:12:25.600 --> 00:12:29.400
Democratic Republic. And a Democratic Republic is something that is

231
00:12:29.400 --> 00:12:30.600
great different than anything

232
00:12:30.600 --> 00:12:33.800
Paul would have known or Luther would have known but it doesn't change

233
00:12:33.800 --> 00:12:34.500
the rules.

234
00:12:35.200 --> 00:12:39.000
It doesn't change the basic truths. It doesn't change the basic reality of

235
00:12:39.000 --> 00:12:40.200
what God has set in place.

236
00:12:40.200 --> 00:12:43.500
The government is still God's government however, it gets put there.

237
00:12:43.500 --> 00:12:47.200
So even if a government comes into existence through a bloody coup

238
00:12:47.200 --> 00:12:49.500
d'etat God has let it happen.

239
00:12:49.500 --> 00:12:54.200
God is established that government and it's there. And so we have a

240
00:12:54.200 --> 00:12:56.700
different kind of situation cuz our government is a Democratic

241
00:12:56.700 --> 00:13:02.100
Republic which means in a very real sense we're government were part of it.

242
00:13:02.100 --> 00:13:05.900
We vote. We put people in office. We can appeal to them.

243
00:13:05.900 --> 00:13:10.100
We can actually try to influence them far more than the average person

244
00:13:10.100 --> 00:13:11.000
could in Luther's day.

245
00:13:11.000 --> 00:13:14.600
So we're part of the government which means that we have a

246
00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:18.200
responsibility as Christians living in the world to do that work,

247
00:13:18.200 --> 00:13:21.800
well. We need to be engaged with our government.

248
00:13:21.800 --> 00:13:23.700
We need to be engaged with our leaders.

249
00:13:23.700 --> 00:13:25.200
That means we need to vote.

250
00:13:25.200 --> 00:13:29.000
We need to be paying attention to what's going on so we can vote well.

251
00:13:29.000 --> 00:13:33.800
And we need a vote the way down God would have us vote. We can vote wrongly.

252
00:13:33.800 --> 00:13:34.700
We can error when we vote.

253
00:13:35.100 --> 00:13:38.200
We can even sin when we vote.

254
00:13:38.200 --> 00:13:39.600
You can think about it.

255
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:43.500
If all my life is lived in the context of God's truth and I'm living

256
00:13:43.500 --> 00:13:44.900
God's way in the world.

257
00:13:44.900 --> 00:13:48.200
If I'm living at variance with God's plan for my life or at

258
00:13:48.200 --> 00:13:51.300
variance is God's will for my life as a creature that's called sin.

259
00:13:51.300 --> 00:13:55.200
And if I'm using my responsibility to participate in the Democratic

260
00:13:55.200 --> 00:13:59.100
Republic and I vote and I vote in a way it is at odds with God's will

261
00:13:59.100 --> 00:14:03.300
that's a sin. You see I can't hide and that's just temporal realm

262
00:14:03.300 --> 00:14:03.500
stuff.

263
00:14:03.500 --> 00:14:04.200
That's politics.

264
00:14:04.200 --> 00:14:07.100
God has nothing to say about it got us something to say about

265
00:14:07.100 --> 00:14:07.700
everything.

266
00:14:07.700 --> 00:14:13.300
So yes, I can sin when I vote and we need to take that

267
00:14:13.300 --> 00:14:14.100
seriously.

268
00:14:14.100 --> 00:14:17.400
I'm a ChristianlLiving in a Democratic Republic.

269
00:14:17.400 --> 00:14:18.700
I must vote.

270
00:14:18.700 --> 00:14:19.900
So how do I vote?

271
00:14:20.700 --> 00:14:23.000
Well there are some guidelines for that and we have time we'll talk about

272
00:14:23.000 --> 00:14:23.300
those.

273
00:14:23.300 --> 00:14:25.800
I brought a Lutheran witness article just earlier this summer.

274
00:14:25.800 --> 00:14:27.300
You can check that out.

275
00:14:27.300 --> 00:14:31.500
And if we have time, I'll unpack that little bit more and review that

276
00:14:31.500 --> 00:14:33.200
if we have time, we'll see how things go here.

277
00:14:33.200 --> 00:14:39.200
I'd like to get to that and we'll see if I do but we we have a

278
00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:40.200
responsibility to do this.

279
00:14:40.200 --> 00:14:44.100
So the person on the far-right who says there's no candidate

280
00:14:44.100 --> 00:14:46.000
reflects God's way of doing things entirely.

281
00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:47.700
I'm not going to vote. Is wrong

282
00:14:47.700 --> 00:14:50.000
she needs to vote or he needs to vote.

283
00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:50.400
Now

284
00:14:50.400 --> 00:14:53.400
when you go vote, who do you vote for? Well you can pick one of the

285
00:14:53.400 --> 00:14:56.900
sixth party candidates who may be opposed all the things that you

286
00:14:56.900 --> 00:14:59.400
think are important and feel good about that vote.

287
00:14:59.400 --> 00:15:03.700
I would question that if that's really a good use of your vote in a

288
00:15:03.700 --> 00:15:08.100
Democratic Republic like ours which has a two-party system de facto

289
00:15:08.100 --> 00:15:11.200
and in operation not by requirement.

290
00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:15.300
But that's how it has come let the playout. So we have a two party system so

291
00:15:15.300 --> 00:15:19.100
you can vote for a off party candidate, which is basically throwing

292
00:15:19.100 --> 00:15:20.700
away your vote and nullifying its impact.

293
00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:26.600
Or you can vote for one of the two other candidates and say who should

294
00:15:26.600 --> 00:15:30.500
I get my vote to so this is going to be actually shaping the shape of

295
00:15:30.500 --> 00:15:33.100
this Republic for the next four years or two years.

296
00:15:33.100 --> 00:15:34.300
How should I vote?

297
00:15:34.300 --> 00:15:37.800
Well, I think you should vote for the candidate who's going to do more

298
00:15:37.800 --> 00:15:39.200
nearly uphold

299
00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:45.800
the most of God's moral law as can possibly be up help. And your going to vote

300
00:15:45.800 --> 00:15:49.300
for the one that's going to be up holding those things that are

301
00:15:49.300 --> 00:15:56.000
significantly central to that moral code. Like not taking life and

302
00:15:56.000 --> 00:16:01.600
protecting those who are most at risk and most

303
00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:07.900
helpless. Which then if you think about it this way the unborn rise

304
00:16:07.900 --> 00:16:11.400
right to the top of the scale. Which is why the Roman Catholic Church

305
00:16:11.400 --> 00:16:15.100
just recently issued a declaration that her people should be voting

306
00:16:15.100 --> 00:16:19.600
for the church agreed and that the teaching of the church honors life

307
00:16:19.600 --> 00:16:23.600
agreed and that those things are more important than other moral

308
00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:24.700
issues agreed.

309
00:16:24.700 --> 00:16:29.200
I think Rome's right on this and a lot of Christians resent being a

310
00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:31.000
one issue voter. It's more than abortion.

311
00:16:31.000 --> 00:16:34.800
And I hear this all the time well sure there's lots of issues and a

312
00:16:34.800 --> 00:16:37.900
lot of issues that are really important and God cares about them, but

313
00:16:37.900 --> 00:16:41.800
they're not all the same. And protecting a wetland and protecting an

314
00:16:41.800 --> 00:16:44.700
unborn baby aren't the same. And it's not the wetland

315
00:16:44.700 --> 00:16:45.500
that wins that one.

316
00:16:45.500 --> 00:16:46.300
I'm sorry.

317
00:16:46.300 --> 00:16:49.700
So what are you tell your liberal friend who is all wrapped up in

318
00:16:49.700 --> 00:16:52.700
social justice, but not caring too much about unborn babies.

319
00:16:52.700 --> 00:16:54.000
I think I just challenge him.

320
00:16:54.000 --> 00:16:55.500
Where's the fifth commandment fit?

321
00:16:55.500 --> 00:16:56.700
How big a deal is that?

322
00:16:56.700 --> 00:17:01.400
Yeah, social justice important. Racism is bad its evil not right. Christians need to resist racism.

323
00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:05.300
And there are lots of ways you can talk about doing that. And lots of policies. See this is also where

324
00:17:05.300 --> 00:17:08.300
it gets important.

325
00:17:08.300 --> 00:17:11.090
Robert Bennett has been very helpful here on distinguishing between

326
00:17:11.090 --> 00:17:16.590
sexual core tenants of at each of a compassion and what might be just

327
00:17:16.590 --> 00:17:17.500
policy issues.

328
00:17:17.500 --> 00:17:18.900
So we might all agree racism

329
00:17:18.900 --> 00:17:19.800
isn't as bad.

330
00:17:19.800 --> 00:17:23.900
How do you end? Well there is all kinds of discussion room there,

331
00:17:23.900 --> 00:17:30.200
now. What policies are best? More policing less policing. More enforcement less enforcement. Affirmative action

332
00:17:30.200 --> 00:17:34.600
no affirmative action? What actually ends racism that's not so simple and

333
00:17:34.600 --> 00:17:36.700
something goes with immigration things.

334
00:17:36.700 --> 00:17:41.900
So is immigration an inherent right someone can live where they want?

335
00:17:41.900 --> 00:17:45.500
No. And is it inherent right that we can keep America pure and keep

336
00:17:45.500 --> 00:17:47.500
people out to keep America pure? No.

337
00:17:47.500 --> 00:17:51.400
There's nothing scriptural about that. Nation-states aren't you know

338
00:17:51.400 --> 00:17:52.800
preferred by God.

339
00:17:52.800 --> 00:17:56.500
So there's nothing sacred about keeping America pure and keeping, you

340
00:17:56.500 --> 00:18:00.500
know immigrants out who we don't want that doesn't wash. But then

341
00:18:00.500 --> 00:18:03.100
how do we then care for that neighbor?

342
00:18:03.100 --> 00:18:04.600
How do we care for the Immigrant?

343
00:18:04.600 --> 00:18:06.700
We'll just all kinds of discussion about that.

344
00:18:06.700 --> 00:18:16.300
What policies are best and what laws are best, it's not easy. But with abortion it's different. It's really quit different because with abortion is it   wrong to kill a person?

345
00:18:16.300 --> 00:18:18.100
Yeah, that's wrong.

346
00:18:18.100 --> 00:18:30.600
I don't care who they are. It's wrong to kill. This is a violation of God's law. It's a violation of natural law and everyone knows it. Is a child in utero a person? Everyone knows that's the case too. So is it right to kill that child? No. But wait the

347
00:18:30.600 --> 00:18:40.400
rights of the individual. Oh wait where do you get rights talk your getting all confused by your rights talk. This is clear cut you kill babies in utero. And it's not an issue of policy

348
00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:43.900
now either. It's either you kill them or you don't. It's not a matter of

349
00:18:43.900 --> 00:18:47.600
which policies are going to help the baby in utero you don't kill

350
00:18:47.600 --> 00:18:54.000
them.  It's kind of easy. It's kind of clear cut. So you see that's why Rome is right to make this a high

351
00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:56.700
priority and that's why we in the Lutheran Church should agree with

352
00:18:56.700 --> 00:18:59.600
that. And we might get tired of always talking abortion, abortion,

353
00:18:59.600 --> 00:19:01.400
abortion like that's the only thing that matters

354
00:19:01.400 --> 00:19:02.900
but kind of it matters.

355
00:19:03.200 --> 00:19:08.800
And I would yearn love to live in a society where we can talk

356
00:19:08.800 --> 00:19:15.200
about racial issues and climate change issues and immigration issues

357
00:19:15.200 --> 00:19:22.700
and and way between issues and have differences of opinion important.

358
00:19:22.700 --> 00:19:25.900
And not have to be always thinking about that

359
00:19:25.900 --> 00:19:30.600
but what about abortion. If we could take that off the table and stop killing

360
00:19:30.600 --> 00:19:34.700
babies in utero and be able to then focus on other things that would be

361
00:19:34.700 --> 00:19:35.100
great.

362
00:19:35.100 --> 00:19:42.000
I love to be able to zero in on some of these third and fourth sort of issues that matter to God but there's there's that issue

363
00:19:42.000 --> 00:19:44.900
of abortion and it doesn't go away and it's right there and it's

364
00:19:44.900 --> 00:19:49.600
important and so I guess I have no apologies about it. For now

365
00:19:49.600 --> 00:19:51.700
we have to kind of be single-issue voters.

366
00:19:51.700 --> 00:19:52.600
It's just that important.

367
00:19:52.600 --> 00:19:56.700
So am I endorsing one candidate not necessarily am I endorsing one party?

368
00:19:56.700 --> 00:20:00.900
No. But I'm saying that if you have a candidate who is going to be

369
00:20:00.900 --> 00:20:02.700
supporting continuing

370
00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:05.600
killing a babies in utero because it's a right of the woman.

371
00:20:05.600 --> 00:20:09.700
I don't know how you can support that and I will consider that to be a

372
00:20:09.700 --> 00:20:17.400
violation of God's will. So I think you tell your liberal friend who wants to support that. What do you do with the 5th Commandment? What do you do with killing babies.

373
00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:18.400
That's what you're doing here.

374
00:20:18.400 --> 00:20:21.100
And just force them back to the issue and have them come to terms with

375
00:20:21.100 --> 00:20:23.800
that sympathize with him about the other issues, but don't let him off

376
00:20:23.800 --> 00:20:24.000
the hook.

377
00:20:24.000 --> 00:20:28.200
And then your other person who says I don't want to vote get off of

378
00:20:28.200 --> 00:20:31.300
your personal piety and you're trying to preserve your personal purity

379
00:20:31.300 --> 00:20:34.300
and go do your responsibilities, get a little dirty out in the world.

380
00:20:34.300 --> 00:20:37.600
If you have to ask God for forgiveness for voting for one candidate or

381
00:20:37.600 --> 00:20:41.300
another go ahead and do that cuz you're right both candidates on the

382
00:20:41.300 --> 00:20:45.000
other major tickets to the President Trump or on Biden both have

383
00:20:45.000 --> 00:20:48.200
things that are not appealing from a Christian standpoint.

384
00:20:48.200 --> 00:20:52.400
No doubt about that, but it is not a matter of do I like everything or

385
00:20:52.400 --> 00:20:56.200
can I support everything or are they a perfect example, probably

386
00:20:56.200 --> 00:21:01.500
not. But which one is going to be nearly upholding God's plans

387
00:21:01.500 --> 00:21:03.100
for his creation and God's

388
00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:09.300
definition of justice and God's standard of what's right, according to

389
00:21:09.300 --> 00:21:10.000
the moral code.

390
00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:13.300
And the candidate that's going to be a advancing that I would stay is the one

391
00:21:13.300 --> 00:21:13.900
who should get your vote.

392
00:21:13.900 --> 00:21:15.700
That's how I think you should look at it.

393
00:21:15.700 --> 00:21:19.800
I don't think you can opt out if I don't want to vote or I'll just go

394
00:21:19.800 --> 00:21:22.500
for an off candidate because then I'll just a morally pure.

395
00:21:23.500 --> 00:21:25.400
I find that hard to justify.

396
00:21:25.400 --> 00:21:26.700
All right.

397
00:21:26.700 --> 00:21:28.100
Now, what about the government?

398
00:21:28.100 --> 00:21:31.600
Do we want the government to just going to be on upholding a fair

399
00:21:31.600 --> 00:21:33.600
chance for everybody? In a sense.

400
00:21:33.600 --> 00:21:36.500
But that's really not the goal for a government. Paul says the

401
00:21:36.500 --> 00:21:41.100
government is there to enforce what is right and to enforce justice so

402
00:21:41.100 --> 00:21:46.200
you punish the evildoer and to advance the cause of the marginalized. I

403
00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:48.700
think Luther's right about the three virtues of the prince.

404
00:21:48.700 --> 00:21:51.300
We might debate about whether they should be supporting the

405
00:21:51.300 --> 00:21:53.600
proclamation of God's word and pressing blasphemy.

406
00:21:53.600 --> 00:22:00.600
Probably not in our day and age that's pretty hard to do. But not now is

407
00:22:00.600 --> 00:22:03.700
the governments job than to try to get everybody a fair

408
00:22:03.700 --> 00:22:06.700
shake and that that means allowing gay people to get married.

409
00:22:06.700 --> 00:22:07.600
That's fine.

410
00:22:07.600 --> 00:22:12.200
Who cares, we care because the erosion of marriage is an

411
00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:16.400
erosion of God's plan for his creation. And God did design man and woman

412
00:22:16.400 --> 00:22:18.600
to be together or not, man and man or woman and woman.

413
00:22:18.700 --> 00:22:23.100
And even if it's a genetic reality for people and it could be it

414
00:22:23.100 --> 00:22:26.000
doesn't change the reality of how God wants us to live in how he

415
00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:31.400
designed us to live. The brokenness of the fall messes up all kinds of stuff, doesn't make it right,

416
00:22:31.400 --> 00:22:32.600
doesn't make it morally acceptable.

417
00:22:32.600 --> 00:22:37.100
So we uphold God's truth and we want to advance God's truth.

418
00:22:37.100 --> 00:22:40.300
So no, I don't think we should endorse the government just giving

419
00:22:40.300 --> 00:22:43.400
fair rides to everybody. Now the government's job to enforce

420
00:22:43.400 --> 00:22:47.400
what is morally right according to God's word and we encourage it to

421
00:22:47.400 --> 00:22:47.800
do that.

422
00:22:47.800 --> 00:22:51.600
Do I expect it to do that in the culture in which we're living the

423
00:22:51.600 --> 00:22:57.300
pluralistic, idealistic, individualistic, Enlightenment based culture? No, I don't expect that to

424
00:22:57.300 --> 00:22:57.800
happen at all.

425
00:22:57.800 --> 00:23:00.200
But I like it too and I'd work for that.

426
00:23:00.200 --> 00:23:02.600
I'm not going to endure something that falls short of that.

427
00:23:02.600 --> 00:23:05.300
I'm going to keep on being a voice for God's truth.

428
00:23:05.300 --> 00:23:07.500
Not in a judgmental harsh way.

429
00:23:07.500 --> 00:23:11.300
As God says, we don't judge outsiders we judge each other and so I

430
00:23:11.300 --> 00:23:14.800
hold each other accountable, but I also not going to capitulate and

431
00:23:14.800 --> 00:23:15.500
stay that's cool everybody gets a right and that's the governments job to uphold every bodies rights.

432
00:23:18.700 --> 00:23:22.500
No, it's not the government's job. Governments job is to uphold God's justice and

433
00:23:22.500 --> 00:23:26.500
that's what we should be working for. All right, so that's those questions. Let's see.

434
00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:34.900
Then we have that address and also the question about our Prince is

435
00:23:34.900 --> 00:23:41.200
not a man but a Constitution why there's. Let me go a little further here. What do Christians need to keep in mind as

436
00:23:41.200 --> 00:23:44.000
we try to render obedience to the governing authorities in such a

437
00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:47.700
system? To what extent are they entitled to obedience when they require

438
00:23:47.700 --> 00:23:53.200
things beyond what they are allowed to in our constitutional system? The Church is not to insist on her rights

439
00:23:53.200 --> 00:23:56.900
only require enough for room to proclaim Christ and follow him. Is there any place for

440
00:23:56.900 --> 00:24:00.900
the Church to advocate for but not insist on her own place in public

441
00:24:00.900 --> 00:24:05.000
life. Now the Church doesn't need to advocate for her place in public life. She just has it.

442
00:24:05.000 --> 00:24:08.200
She just does it. And so even if they outlaw Christians will keep on

443
00:24:08.200 --> 00:24:09.900
doing what we do. See is not a matter of

444
00:24:09.900 --> 00:24:18.400
we have to have a right or a legal legal room to do it, no we'll do it. When Christianity was declared illegal at different times in the Early Church di it

445
00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:19.200
stop being the church?

446
00:24:19.200 --> 00:24:20.700
Did they stop preaching. Did they stop meeting? Did they stop living the Christian life? No. We kept on doing it even more so. So the space we need we just claim

447
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:29.300
we just take it.

448
00:24:29.300 --> 00:24:31.400
We will live following Christ.

449
00:24:31.400 --> 00:24:32.200
You can kill us but

450
00:24:32.200 --> 00:24:35.300
will live following Christ. You can throw us in prison we will live

451
00:24:35.300 --> 00:24:36.000
following Christ.

452
00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:37.000
You can take away

453
00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:52.000
all of our privileges we will live following Christ. And we will die following Christ, that's what the Church does. That's what Christians do. And we don't need to advocate for permission to do that for laws that allow us to do this or demand or rights to allow us to do this. We just do it. And if we're living in a

454
00:24:52.000 --> 00:24:55.300
culture that privileges us to be able to not persecute us for that.

455
00:24:55.300 --> 00:25:05.300
Nice, maybe me that hurt the Church that's interesting topic for discussion. Whether a Church that has been outlawed is more healthy than the one

456
00:25:05.300 --> 00:25:08.000
that's been a mainstreamed in the Constantinian

457
00:25:08.000 --> 00:25:08.400
rapprochement. That's another discussion for another time. I don't have time for that one today, even though it's relevant.

458
00:25:13.400 --> 00:25:21.100
So I think we need to challenge the idea of the the need to defend our space.

459
00:25:21.100 --> 00:25:29.500
Now , on this whole thing about isn't the government the Constitution? No. The Constitution is not our government.

460
00:25:29.500 --> 00:25:33.000
The Constitution is a document outlining the government.

461
00:25:33.000 --> 00:25:36.000
The government is the people. The government are the institutions.

462
00:25:36.000 --> 00:25:40.500
The government is the individuals who are in the Supreme Court and in

463
00:25:40.500 --> 00:25:45.200
the legislative legislation Congress and the executive office, that's

464
00:25:45.200 --> 00:25:51.400
the government and the government both of them out where the

465
00:25:51.400 --> 00:25:55.000
government. And the government is us. So we are the ones who put them there and hold them accountable, vote them in and vote them out. We're the government. So the Constitution is not our government.

466
00:25:55.000 --> 00:25:56.200
The Constitution is the guideline.

467
00:25:56.200 --> 00:25:57.900
So somebody is violating the Constitution

468
00:25:57.900 --> 00:26:01.200
does that give us the right to take up arms against them?

469
00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:05.900
No, of course not. So they're violating the rules just like they do other

470
00:26:05.900 --> 00:26:06.700
immoral things.

471
00:26:06.700 --> 00:26:10.600
If you have an immoral prince does it give you the right to violently rise

472
00:26:10.600 --> 00:26:11.700
up against them? No.

473
00:26:12.400 --> 00:26:16.000
Might you well, this is where it gets interesting. Bonhoeffer did. Bonhoeffer is in a unique situation. He knows this one man Hitler is

474
00:26:16.000 --> 00:26:29.100
imprisonment and death as they're starting to figure out of countless

475
00:26:29.100 --> 00:26:29.500
people.

476
00:26:29.500 --> 00:26:32.000
They don't know how many at that point in his time.

477
00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:35.700
They knew a lot of what was going they knew the cost of the war.

478
00:26:35.700 --> 00:26:40.400
They knew when is because of this this guy Hitler and so Bonhoeffer and

479
00:26:40.400 --> 00:26:44.900
others prayerfully concluded that given the opportunity which they had

480
00:26:44.900 --> 00:26:48.300
to intervene for the sake of the neighbor they would do that.

481
00:26:48.300 --> 00:26:51.500
And so they decided that for the sake of the neighbor they would stop

482
00:26:51.500 --> 00:26:53.500
this tyrant and stop this evil.

483
00:26:53.500 --> 00:26:54.400
They made that decision.

484
00:26:54.400 --> 00:26:57.100
Are they overthrowing the government God has

485
00:26:57.100 --> 00:26:57.900
established?

486
00:26:57.900 --> 00:27:04.100
Yes. Are they guilty for that? Yeah.  And they knew that. But they were also trying to care for their

487
00:27:04.100 --> 00:27:06.800
neighbor. They were trying to protect their neighbor and they're trying to

488
00:27:06.800 --> 00:27:10.300
serve the neighbor who's being hurt by this horrible war and by this

489
00:27:10.300 --> 00:27:11.700
horrible regime, Third Reich.

490
00:27:12.300 --> 00:27:16.100
So they made a decision and they did that and they took responsibility

491
00:27:16.100 --> 00:27:16.800
for the decision.

492
00:27:16.800 --> 00:27:20.800
You don't ever hear Bonhoeffer saying I'm unjustly imprisoned for

493
00:27:20.800 --> 00:27:21.300
this isn't fair.

494
00:27:21.300 --> 00:27:26.000
He just takes responsibility for what he did and he chose to and that's what we do as

495
00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:26.200
Christians.

496
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:30.500
We follow Christ and if the government likes it great if they don't

497
00:27:30.500 --> 00:27:34.300
whatever we're going to follow Christ, we don't stop. You see now the

498
00:27:34.300 --> 00:27:37.600
difference then is the person who's going to fight the government to

499
00:27:37.600 --> 00:27:38.700
uphold the Constitution.

500
00:27:38.700 --> 00:27:49.200
He's not fighting for a principle or something. He's really fighting to uphold a way of life that he wants to preserve. It becomes in a sense very self serving. And it's very different because it's not like

501
00:27:49.200 --> 00:28:00.900
this new government is gassing people and waging wars and taking space that is not theirs. That's not what's going on. We just don't like the immorality of it.

502
00:28:00.900 --> 00:28:05.600
It's not cause for overthrowing and you can't hide behind why I'm

503
00:28:05.600 --> 00:28:08.600
defending the the Constitution, which is more important than the leaders. That's wrong. The government is not he Constitution the government is the people.

504
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:14.600
So I'll push against that.

505
00:28:14.600 --> 00:28:17.200
Alright, let's see another question here.

506
00:28:17.200 --> 00:28:20.500
What are your thoughts on displaying the American flag in the church

507
00:28:20.500 --> 00:28:21.500
Sanctuary? What about reciting the pledge during a church service?

508
00:28:21.500 --> 00:28:36.800
Yeah, let's do that now because the next topic I want to get to doesn't come back to that. So we will get this one done. So if we understand the two realms. And understand you got the spiritual realm and you've got the

509
00:28:36.800 --> 00:28:38.400
temporal realm and they're working.

510
00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:50.300
Temporal, spiritual be consistent  You've got these realms working doing different things, working in concert together.  Cooperating but not confusing and distinct but not

511
00:28:50.300 --> 00:28:50.900
divorced.

512
00:28:50.900 --> 00:28:55.800
What about this kind of overlap of displays of patriotism in the

513
00:28:55.800 --> 00:28:59.900
Divine service. And I would say we should be cautious there because we

514
00:28:59.900 --> 00:29:06.900
start again explicit symbols or actions and practices of the temporal

515
00:29:06.900 --> 00:29:12.000
realm Into the heart of the spiritual realm that reads the potential

516
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:12.100
for confusion.

517
00:29:12.400 --> 00:29:16.100
And when we put an American flag in a Christian chancel.

518
00:29:16.100 --> 00:29:20.700
It gives the impression that this is an American religious service or

519
00:29:20.700 --> 00:29:25.300
that the America or that Jesus is America's God that's not accurate.

520
00:29:25.300 --> 00:29:30.100
That's quite confusing Christianity is much bigger than America and

521
00:29:30.100 --> 00:29:33.300
America is not coexistent with the Christian confession.

522
00:29:33.300 --> 00:29:34.500
These are two different things.

523
00:29:34.500 --> 00:29:40.600
And so I think a flag in a Sanctuary is not appropriate. An

524
00:29:40.600 --> 00:29:43.500
American flag in a Sanctuary is not appropriate because it gives the

525
00:29:43.500 --> 00:29:48.400
impression that this space is an American space and that what American

526
00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:50.900
does is what we're all about here at the church as well.

527
00:29:50.900 --> 00:29:54.700
And we're not. Now, I'm not anti-American and there is no place for the Church

528
00:29:54.700 --> 00:30:00.500
to acknowledge it as part of the American, American Country, sure. The flag can go maybe out on the

529
00:30:00.500 --> 00:30:00.900
road.

530
00:30:00.900 --> 00:30:03.500
It's not a bad place for it or if they have to be in the building

531
00:30:03.500 --> 00:30:06.600
could be maybe in the narthex. The sanctuary the place where God

532
00:30:06.600 --> 00:30:11.100
delivers his grace. The sanctuary is the place where God is doing means of Grace stuff.

533
00:30:11.100 --> 00:30:12.300
The sanctuary is the place of the

534
00:30:12.300 --> 00:30:17.900
Gospel and patriotic stuff doesn't belong there. It belongs in the ballpark and on

535
00:30:17.900 --> 00:30:20.800
the parade route on the 4th of July and the front yard and doing

536
00:30:20.800 --> 00:30:21.100
fireworks.

537
00:30:21.100 --> 00:30:25.900
That's a great place for patriotism but not at a divine service.

538
00:30:25.900 --> 00:30:29.800
And so then saying the Pledge of Allegiance in the divine service? No. Just flat out no

539
00:30:29.800 --> 00:30:32.900
and singingThe Star Spangled Banner.

540
00:30:32.900 --> 00:30:39.700
No, no those don't belong there. They are things that Christians can do and

541
00:30:39.700 --> 00:30:42.800
the Christians can be rejoicing and but not there.

542
00:30:42.800 --> 00:30:47.300
So do we try to expunge all parts of the government from the

543
00:30:47.300 --> 00:30:48.400
from the sanctuary?

544
00:30:48.400 --> 00:30:49.300
Not at all.

545
00:30:49.300 --> 00:30:52.700
We're told by scripture to pray for our leaders to pray for our

546
00:30:52.700 --> 00:30:55.300
government to pray for those in authority over us.

547
00:30:55.300 --> 00:30:58.400
So we should pray for them and we should be willing to acknowledge

548
00:30:58.400 --> 00:31:02.700
those who have served well and we can even acknowledge the veterans

549
00:31:02.700 --> 00:31:06.800
and the First Responders in our own congregations and pray for them

550
00:31:06.800 --> 00:31:11.400
and thank them for their service and in name of my name, that's all

551
00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:12.000
appropriate.

552
00:31:12.300 --> 00:31:13.000
There's nothing wrong with that.

553
00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:17.800
So there's a place for that but there's not a place for is trying to

554
00:31:17.800 --> 00:31:24.400
promote the American agenda or trying to look more American. That you need

555
00:31:24.400 --> 00:31:25.100
be careful about.

556
00:31:25.100 --> 00:31:28.300
So I would say yeah, we have to be really careful about the how much

557
00:31:28.300 --> 00:31:29.500
patriotism comes into play here.

558
00:31:30.700 --> 00:31:31.300
All right.

559
00:31:31.300 --> 00:31:34.200
Now the question if rights don't exist then how are we supposed to

560
00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:37.200
defend the life of the unborn and elderly or could we say we have

561
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:43.600
rights in front of our neighbor but not in front of God? I would say we might use the tools

562
00:31:43.600 --> 00:31:47.400
of the country in which were living which is all about rights as a way

563
00:31:47.400 --> 00:31:51.900
to help them see the inequity and the injustice. Not really inequity

564
00:31:51.900 --> 00:31:56.900
that's not the point. The injustice or what's being done to the unborn when we kill them. So if I

565
00:31:56.900 --> 00:31:59.000
had my way I wouldn't call it the right to life.

566
00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:03.100
I just think that's kind of confusing things from a Christian

567
00:32:03.100 --> 00:32:05.900
standpoint. From the world's stand point it makes perfect sense

568
00:32:05.900 --> 00:32:11.200
everybody gets it so it's fine. And it conveys a lot but I don't think

569
00:32:11.200 --> 00:32:15.300
that the fundamental part of my argument is the unborns right to life.

570
00:32:15.300 --> 00:32:19.300
I think the fundamental of argument is that they need my protection.

571
00:32:19.300 --> 00:32:23.800
They have no one who's going to defend them unless we do and that

572
00:32:23.800 --> 00:32:28.600
these are the helpless creatures of God who are needing our defense.

573
00:32:28.600 --> 00:32:29.600
We need to defend them.

574
00:32:29.600 --> 00:32:30.500
That's why I protect them not

575
00:32:30.700 --> 00:32:37.400
because they have a right to life and I am trying to uphold their right. I'm trying to save their life because it's being threatened, that's the point.

576
00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:44.700
I think that's a better more consistent Christian argument. in the context  of our culture again which is all about rights and people understand

577
00:32:44.700 --> 00:32:45.400
that way of talking.

578
00:32:45.400 --> 00:32:47.500
Okay, you can invoke the language of rights.

579
00:32:47.500 --> 00:32:52.200
It definitely is meaningful to people and helps to clarify that the

580
00:32:52.200 --> 00:32:54.000
issue for people who like me wouldn't get it. The something goes for the elderly

581
00:32:54.000 --> 00:32:57.900
it's not a matter of if they have a right to something, it's a matter of this is what we do show compassion.

582
00:32:57.900 --> 00:33:09.100
We protect he life God has given and we honor that life so we don't euthanize, we don't institutionalize get rid of people who are inconvenient.

583
00:33:09.100 --> 00:33:12.000
We keep on loving them and caring for them and caring for them as the

584
00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:12.900
creatures that God has created and God has made.

585
00:33:15.400 --> 00:33:18.200
All right, how would you differentiate between Bonhoeffer and his

586
00:33:18.200 --> 00:33:20.800
compatriots fighting against Hitler and the Nazi government and the

587
00:33:20.800 --> 00:33:24.400
revolutionaries fighting against King George and his government? Huge

588
00:33:24.400 --> 00:33:28.300
difference. Revolutionaries are fighting for their rights

589
00:33:28.300 --> 00:33:29.200
there fighting for their freedom.

590
00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:32.700
They're fighting to get the Brits off their turf there fighting for

591
00:33:32.700 --> 00:33:40.600
the inequities of the Stamp Act and the Quartering Act and they don't like any of these things. Darn it they don't want King George pushing them around. And it's not

592
00:33:40.600 --> 00:33:40.690
fair.

593
00:33:40.690 --> 00:33:43.900
No taxation without representation so it's was basically all self-serving.

594
00:33:43.900 --> 00:33:47.800
Bonhoeffer's efforts to try to get rid of Hitler was all about serving

595
00:33:47.800 --> 00:33:51.600
the neighbor and all about trying to preserve Jewish life and the

596
00:33:51.600 --> 00:33:53.600
lives of allies and allies of Germans

597
00:33:53.600 --> 00:33:57.100
who are getting caught in the vice of this war.

598
00:33:57.100 --> 00:33:57.700
So

599
00:33:58.600 --> 00:33:59.800
I think it's very different.

600
00:33:59.800 --> 00:34:07.200
I think it's all so different in the the extent to which they go.  Bonhoeffer not organizing a militia or an underground army. He's

601
00:34:07.200 --> 00:34:13.800
involved in a very focused pointed coup to try to end one life. It's very

602
00:34:13.800 --> 00:34:17.700
different than raising a militia and fighting a protracted Army

603
00:34:17.700 --> 00:34:21.400
against another Army that's legitimate where yours is not. So I think

604
00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:27.500
there are  enormance differences between the American revolutionaries and actins of Bonhoeffer. And all

605
00:34:27.500 --> 00:34:31.300
that aside it always comes down to the individual having to be able to

606
00:34:31.300 --> 00:34:34.600
justify in a sense himself before God. And be to stand in front of God and say;

607
00:34:34.600 --> 00:34:40.300
I was put in this situation but these opportunities and here's what I

608
00:34:40.300 --> 00:34:40.600
did with that.

609
00:34:40.600 --> 00:34:49.500
I think Bonhoeffer legitimately can stand in front of God and say: I was in this situation with this opportunity to stop this man from doing this harm to this many

610
00:34:49.500 --> 00:34:49.700
people.

611
00:34:49.700 --> 00:34:55.000
So I did this and if I'm culpable for that, so be it but I am still

612
00:34:55.000 --> 00:34:58.500
believe in the right way if I was wrong, then I confess that. And you

613
00:34:58.500 --> 00:34:58.500
don't hear that

614
00:34:58.600 --> 00:35:11.100
attitude from the Americans. It's quit the opposite. It's very arrogant and here I stand and I will do my thing give me liberty or give me death.  it's it's all about fighting for the principles of

615
00:35:11.100 --> 00:35:14.200
Liberty, which is defined as right to do what I want.

616
00:35:14.200 --> 00:35:23.700
That's not an American rallying cry or a Christian rallying cry, it's an American not a Christian rallying cry. it's not a rallying cry that you would have heard from Bonhoeffer, at all.

617
00:35:23.700 --> 00:35:25.100
All right.

618
00:35:25.100 --> 00:35:27.300
Good now I am all caught up on your questions.

619
00:35:27.300 --> 00:35:32.400
So now that's the first round will have time again here in just a

620
00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:34.900
little bit to do more of that.

621
00:35:34.900 --> 00:35:38.700
So we got a little less about for a little more than 45 minutes left.

622
00:35:38.700 --> 00:35:41.700
So get your questions in thinking about then you can raise your hand

623
00:35:41.700 --> 00:35:44.800
and Brian will feed them to me verbally and we can do that.

624
00:35:44.800 --> 00:35:48.890
I want to give you just a couple more things concrete leads to kind of

625
00:35:48.890 --> 00:35:53.500
feed some of your thinking on this even though I'm starting to address some of these nitty gritty things already and

626
00:35:53.500 --> 00:35:54.400
to pull this stuff together.

627
00:35:54.400 --> 00:35:57.200
First I want to I want to go back to Luther.

628
00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:01.600
And this is from a very early one of those documents called the

629
00:36:01.600 --> 00:36:04.200
"Freedom of the Christian", which was from 1520,

630
00:36:04.200 --> 00:36:07.800
I think if I remember right the date on this.  This very early Luther what's

631
00:36:07.800 --> 00:36:13.800
fascinating how already early in the Reformation Luther is operating with

632
00:36:13.800 --> 00:36:17.000
the fundamental moves of his theology firmly in place.

633
00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:22.800
He didn't evolve in his theological positions.

634
00:36:22.800 --> 00:36:25.600
He was formed in the faith of the church that we he confessed that's

635
00:36:25.600 --> 00:36:28.800
what he kept on confessing. Things were clear clarified for him.

636
00:36:28.800 --> 00:36:32.100
He would maybe emphasize certain things more than others, but he

637
00:36:32.100 --> 00:36:39.700
didn't evolve in his theology. Like people talk about changing his theology. He didn't change his theology.  But it definitely would be

638
00:36:39.700 --> 00:36:49.300
more focused areas. But already in 1520 he has this marvelous little essay called the "Freedom of the Christian" and he has two parts in it that really jump out these far

639
00:36:49.300 --> 00:36:51.000
as I'm concerned in the context of this discussion.

640
00:36:51.000 --> 00:36:55.200
And the first one is this very famous part where he says, he's got

641
00:36:55.200 --> 00:36:57.900
these two sentences back-to-back right the front of the essay.

642
00:36:57.900 --> 00:37:04.200
He write this: A Christian is a perfectly free Lord of all subject

643
00:37:04.200 --> 00:37:04.600
to none.

644
00:37:05.600 --> 00:37:09.400
The very next statement: A Christian is a perfectly dutiful servant of all

645
00:37:09.400 --> 00:37:19.800
subject to all. people say whoa now there's and interesting paradox there's an interesting contradiction and it's neither one.

646
00:37:19.800 --> 00:37:20.800
It's not a paradox.

647
00:37:20.800 --> 00:37:21.700
It's not a contradiction.

648
00:37:21.700 --> 00:37:27.600
It's talking about two realities concurrently true to different in two

649
00:37:27.600 --> 00:37:32.600
dimensions two different applications two different arenas.

650
00:37:32.600 --> 00:37:36.400
And what Luther's doing here is his I think I'm going to argue his

651
00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:39.600
he's mapping exactly on track with the two Realms.

652
00:37:39.600 --> 00:37:42.600
Think about this. Before God

653
00:37:43.100 --> 00:37:50.200
in my Gospel reality forgiven child of God baptized claimed by god

654
00:37:50.200 --> 00:37:55.700
named by God heir for eternal life of God in all his gifts.

655
00:37:55.700 --> 00:37:56.900
That's who I am.

656
00:37:56.900 --> 00:38:02.500
I am a perfectly free Lord of all subject to none. Satan can't touch

657
00:38:02.500 --> 00:38:02.700
me.

658
00:38:02.700 --> 00:38:04.200
No, man can accuse me.

659
00:38:04.200 --> 00:38:05.900
I am subject to no law.

660
00:38:05.900 --> 00:38:08.000
I'm subject to no guilt.

661
00:38:08.000 --> 00:38:08.900
I am subject to nothing.

662
00:38:08.900 --> 00:38:12.300
I am a free Lord of all before God in the mercy

663
00:38:12.300 --> 00:38:16.700
I have in Christ. And I owe nobody nothing I have to do nothing to earn

664
00:38:16.700 --> 00:38:17.300
God's favor.

665
00:38:17.300 --> 00:38:19.500
I have to do nothing to maintain God's favor.

666
00:38:19.500 --> 00:38:25.400
I'm a simple Lord of all simply receiving all that God gives and all

667
00:38:25.400 --> 00:38:28.900
that is mine in my reality of Christ. I'm a lord of everything.

668
00:38:28.900 --> 00:38:30.100
That's who I am in Christ.

669
00:38:30.100 --> 00:38:34.900
I a free Lord of all spiritually in the spiritual realm

670
00:38:34.900 --> 00:38:38.200
That's where I am. But now in the temporal Realm

671
00:38:38.700 --> 00:38:44.000
In the world in my life before my fellow man and for my neighbor, I

672
00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:49.000
am a perfectly dutiful servant of all subject to all, exactly.

673
00:38:49.000 --> 00:38:52.700
I am at the mercy of my neighbor.

674
00:38:52.700 --> 00:38:54.900
What does he need me to do I will do it.

675
00:38:54.900 --> 00:38:58.900
What is he want me to do if it was in God's will I'll do it.

676
00:38:58.900 --> 00:38:59.900
I don't live for myself.

677
00:38:59.900 --> 00:39:01.400
I live for him.

678
00:39:01.400 --> 00:39:11.100
I am not trying to advance my own purposes. I'm trying to advance his purposes. I'm not living for the benefit of my well being in my life and my desires. I'm living for the

679
00:39:11.100 --> 00:39:15.800
benefit of him what he needs what she needs, what advances her well-being.

680
00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:17.000
That's my goal.

681
00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:21.500
That's my purpose. So the Christian has two realities Lord of all

682
00:39:21.500 --> 00:39:28.800
subject to none servant of all subject to all. Yes, two different realms. So in the temporal realm I

683
00:39:28.800 --> 00:39:32.700
live as everybody servant in the spiritual realm I live is the Lord

684
00:39:32.700 --> 00:39:35.900
who has been given everything by God. So then Luther wraps this up

685
00:39:35.900 --> 00:39:36.700
later on in the essay.

686
00:39:36.700 --> 00:39:37.800
Where he writes this.

687
00:39:38.400 --> 00:39:40.200
We conclude therefore that

688
00:39:41.600 --> 00:39:47.100
a Christian lives not in himself but in Christ and in his neighbor.

689
00:39:47.100 --> 00:39:48.300
I just saw a flash.

690
00:39:48.300 --> 00:39:51.500
So I'll say that again. We conclude therefore that a Christian lives not

691
00:39:51.500 --> 00:39:56.300
in himself, but in Christ and in his neighbor, otherwise, he's not a

692
00:39:56.300 --> 00:39:59.600
Christian he lives in Christ through faith.

693
00:39:59.600 --> 00:40:05.100
And his neighbor through love. By my faith is caught up beyond himself into

694
00:40:05.100 --> 00:40:05.400
God.

695
00:40:05.400 --> 00:40:10.700
A love descends beneath himself into his neighbor and yet he always

696
00:40:10.700 --> 00:40:18.900
remains in God and in his love. Exactly. This is exactly what he said in those two sentences. So the Christian lives in faith

697
00:40:18.900 --> 00:40:23.100
toward God that means he's swept up out of himself and pulled up into this

698
00:40:23.100 --> 00:40:26.900
reality of a God is done in my God is doing and he lives in that

699
00:40:26.900 --> 00:40:31.500
reality. He lives outside of himself. He's not about himself. It's not about serving me.

700
00:40:31.500 --> 00:40:33.200
It's not about what makes life better than me.

701
00:40:33.200 --> 00:40:37.100
It's about being pulled up and serving the other and serving the

702
00:40:37.100 --> 00:40:41.000
neighbor the one who needs my particular care and that's who is who getting served

703
00:40:41.500 --> 00:40:47.400
by my action. And then I am swept out to the world

704
00:40:47.400 --> 00:40:50.800
to serve my neighbor so it's both of these things at once. I am swept up

705
00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:54.500
in faith toward God and in love for my neighbor. So love is to place a good

706
00:40:54.500 --> 00:40:58.700
works going and going out and loving my neighbor and then in I simple receive from God and

707
00:40:58.700 --> 00:40:58.800
live

708
00:40:58.800 --> 00:40:59.400
as that Lord.

709
00:40:59.400 --> 00:41:00.600
That's how the Christian lives.

710
00:41:00.600 --> 00:41:06.100
What he doesn't ever do is say what's better for me or do I want what

711
00:41:06.100 --> 00:41:07.000
makes my life better?

712
00:41:07.000 --> 00:41:13.500
And so this applies exactly to living our life in the created realm and

713
00:41:13.500 --> 00:41:16.400
in the political arena because when we go in,

714
00:41:17.400 --> 00:41:18.500
When go out into the world to

715
00:41:18.500 --> 00:41:21.300
serve the world is not about serving myself.

716
00:41:21.300 --> 00:41:26.700
And when I go into the voting booth, it's not about voting for what's

717
00:41:26.700 --> 00:41:33.100
going to help me or make my life better or lower my taxes or spread

718
00:41:33.100 --> 00:41:35.900
the wealth around so I get a little bit more of what's coming to me.

719
00:41:35.900 --> 00:41:37.900
That's not the point here.

720
00:41:37.900 --> 00:41:42.400
That's not the goal. The goal is not to vote for what's going to serve

721
00:41:42.400 --> 00:41:43.900
your agenda or serve you.

722
00:41:43.900 --> 00:41:45.900
You vote the same way

723
00:41:45.900 --> 00:41:46.900
you live the rest of your life.

724
00:41:46.900 --> 00:41:49.600
You vote in a way that's going to serve your neighbor.

725
00:41:49.600 --> 00:41:52.000
So if you're going to vote in a way that's going to serve your unborn

726
00:41:52.000 --> 00:41:56.400
neighbor and protect that has life been do it. If you're going to vote

727
00:41:56.400 --> 00:42:01.400
in a way that's going to the advance the fairness toward the marginalized

728
00:42:01.400 --> 00:42:05.400
community within the culture you do it. This is right and then you can't

729
00:42:05.400 --> 00:42:08.300
decide between the two of those and then you prioritize the one that's going

730
00:42:08.300 --> 00:42:11.100
to be having his life taken away over the one who's going to have a

731
00:42:11.100 --> 00:42:14.500
less interesting life. The one at least has got a life to start with. So I think there are ways of weighting this.

732
00:42:17.300 --> 00:42:19.700
That's what I got into in that Lutheran Witness article.

733
00:42:19.700 --> 00:42:22.300
And so let me just read an excerpt I got to this.

734
00:42:22.300 --> 00:42:32.100
So I this kind of covers this pretty well. So when you cast your ballot think about this triages way of looking at it. First.

735
00:42:32.100 --> 00:42:36.300
your overriding responsibility is to your nearest neighbor who has the

736
00:42:36.300 --> 00:42:39.500
most acute need. So you think about the one that you who is close to

737
00:42:39.500 --> 00:42:42.800
you has the less I need the defenseless neighbor faced with imminent

738
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:46.900
death has a more pressing need for justice than one who may lose access

739
00:42:46.900 --> 00:42:49.800
to a favorite meadow where he likes to stroll. So in other words

740
00:42:49.800 --> 00:42:54.200
the life of the unborn does way more than a social justice issue

741
00:42:54.200 --> 00:42:58.900
perhaps or a you know, maybe a climate issue I would argue it does. You

742
00:42:58.900 --> 00:43:02.700
might disagree with you on that but I would argue it does. Second a protection in human life

743
00:43:02.700 --> 00:43:11.600
outweighs enhancement of human life. Third, and that's self-evident. So I'm just saying it for. So the protection of life outweighs the enhancement of life. People

744
00:43:11.600 --> 00:43:14.400
always ranked ahead of animals or the stuff

745
00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:17.000
we accumulate and want to keep always ranks last.

746
00:43:17.600 --> 00:43:19.600
So it's not a matter of keeping my money.

747
00:43:19.600 --> 00:43:22.000
That's not the point or to be my way of life.

748
00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:23.100
That's not the point either.

749
00:43:23.100 --> 00:43:26.700
Fifth and finally respect for each human person or basic fairness

750
00:43:26.700 --> 00:43:30.000
ranks into the head of any alleged rights to keep what is rightfully

751
00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:33.000
yours. Christians know that what they have belongs to God.

752
00:43:33.000 --> 00:43:36.600
I think yeah that's a great question.

753
00:43:36.600 --> 00:43:41.600
And I think it's a discussion worth having in a church and I would say

754
00:43:41.600 --> 00:43:50.600
the flags really don't belong there. So we'll pursue this a little more. I wasn't planning to harp on flags today but I do mention it in my book.

755
00:43:50.600 --> 00:43:54.500
You're quite right the American flag only made an appearance in

756
00:43:54.500 --> 00:44:01.200
sanctuaries in the U.S.at around the time the World War I and then the Second World War solidified it.

757
00:44:01.200 --> 00:44:04.500
And it was an attempt by German Lutherans to show that the were good

758
00:44:04.500 --> 00:44:08.600
Americas. So we brought the flag in. If you go to countries overseas

759
00:44:08.600 --> 00:44:10.100
there are no flags in the sanctuary.

760
00:44:10.100 --> 00:44:14.900
They don't do it. It's just an American phenomenon and then kind of patriotism

761
00:44:14.900 --> 00:44:17.500
kicked in and so we had this Christian flag getting made up.

762
00:44:17.500 --> 00:44:22.500
Christian flag came into existence around 1900 a little bit after some

763
00:44:22.500 --> 00:44:26.400
YMCA dude made it up one day and if you meet up a pledge to the

764
00:44:26.400 --> 00:44:30.900
Christian flag and all the stuff, so the the Christian flag has no

765
00:44:30.900 --> 00:44:33.100
history at all from the Christian church's standpoint.

766
00:44:33.100 --> 00:44:35.000
We don't need a Christian flag.

767
00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:44.800
We have the crucifix and that's our symbol. And so we do not need to have a Christian flag. So the flags really don't belong in the sanctuary. Now is this worth dying

768
00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:54.800
for? No. Is it worth tearing a church apart for? No. It's not a huge high priority. And so when people wear their Christian t-shirts with a

769
00:44:54.800 --> 00:44:58.800
with a cross and that has an American flag emblazoned

770
00:44:58.800 --> 00:44:59.400
on it.

771
00:44:59.400 --> 00:45:09.900
No, that's not cool. And when stick an American flag in a sanctuary. No, not cool. It does not belong there. And I've even seen the little ichthys  fish on peoples t-shirts with the flag across it American flag.

772
00:45:10.500 --> 00:45:15.100
No, it's not like Jesus is American and it's not like America is God's

773
00:45:15.100 --> 00:45:15.600
chosen Nation.

774
00:45:15.600 --> 00:45:16.600
That's just nonsense.

775
00:45:16.600 --> 00:45:21.900
That's that's transforming culture stuff and we don't have their we're

776
00:45:21.900 --> 00:45:23.800
not like our Evangelical brothers and sisters. We do not buy that stuff.

777
00:45:23.800 --> 00:45:27.400
We should not be doing this.

778
00:45:27.400 --> 00:45:36.400
Now, I don't think it's like I said, worthy of stirring up a whole congregation over it. okay, good thanks guys. So let's take a quick look at this

779
00:45:36.400 --> 00:45:39.300
stuff from Bonhoeffer and while you're formulating your last

780
00:45:39.300 --> 00:45:43.300
questions for our last on 30 minutes or so, and I want to give you one

781
00:45:43.300 --> 00:45:45.300
more kind of chunk to chew on today.

782
00:45:45.300 --> 00:45:48.500
This is from Bonhoeffer's discussion of the four mandates.

783
00:45:49.000 --> 00:45:53.400
And he's talked all this essay about Christ being the all in all and

784
00:45:53.400 --> 00:45:56.200
how the world matters to God and how the church serves the world that

785
00:45:56.200 --> 00:46:02.800
being the Church. And then he spends he ends this essay by discussion of these

786
00:46:02.800 --> 00:46:06.700
four mandates. And he says this as he introduces it. What has been called the four mandates. The world like all created

787
00:46:06.700 --> 00:46:11.500
things is created through Christ and with Christ as it's end and

788
00:46:11.500 --> 00:46:15.600
consists in Christ alone. So there you have the supremacy of Christ all in all.

789
00:46:15.600 --> 00:46:18.600
To speak of the world without speaking of Christ is empty an abstract.

790
00:46:18.600 --> 00:46:23.100
The world is relative to Christ no matter whether it knows it or not.

791
00:46:23.100 --> 00:46:26.900
It's just beautiful just beautiful even if the world doesn't know it it

792
00:46:26.900 --> 00:46:39.800
belongs to Christ and it is Christ it just doesn't know it. The Church testifies to that truth. This relativeness of the world to Christ assumes concrete form in certain mandates of God in the

793
00:46:39.800 --> 00:46:43.700
world. So in other words the way that God is at work in the world and the

794
00:46:43.700 --> 00:46:47.400
way that Christ serves in the world and rules in the world is

795
00:46:47.400 --> 00:46:48.500
concrete.

796
00:46:48.900 --> 00:46:54.200
Is made manifest in four specific ways these four

797
00:46:54.200 --> 00:46:58.500
mandates, certain mandates. The scripture names four such mandates labor, marriage,

798
00:46:58.500 --> 00:47:05.700
governments and the church. And so what Bonhoeffer is doing he's basically

799
00:47:05.700 --> 00:47:10.400
tracking with and running right on the same rails as the Reformation

800
00:47:10.400 --> 00:47:13.500
teaching which have been all over the Middle Ages of the three

801
00:47:13.500 --> 00:47:13.700
Estates.

802
00:47:13.700 --> 00:47:17.500
You've heard of this perhaps before the three Estates the three

803
00:47:17.500 --> 00:47:22.500
Estates our home, Church, government. The three Estates are home,

804
00:47:22.500 --> 00:47:26.500
government, Church, the three Estates. In the Middle Ages and Luther was

805
00:47:26.500 --> 00:47:27.400
right on track with this.

806
00:47:27.400 --> 00:47:31.800
They saw all of human life was encapsulated by these three areas.

807
00:47:31.800 --> 00:47:36.000
All of your life is lived as part of the state, part of the church, part of your

808
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:40.600
responsible is at home. And the key for Luther is how we can each one

809
00:47:40.600 --> 00:47:43.300
of these Estates you got work to do.

810
00:47:44.200 --> 00:47:48.700
Things that God has given you to do, responsibilities to fulfill in a

811
00:47:48.700 --> 00:47:54.600
word vocations. Vocations callings from God that direct me outside of

812
00:47:54.600 --> 00:47:58.700
myself in love meet myself to serve

813
00:47:58.700 --> 00:48:00.700
my neighbor. Not to earn God's

814
00:48:00.700 --> 00:48:05.700
brownie points or God's blessings but to serve my neighbor. And so into

815
00:48:05.700 --> 00:48:10.200
my Estates I go into my vocations I go in the Estates. So in the government

816
00:48:10.200 --> 00:48:14.100
I figure out what is God giving me to do. He's giving me to be a

817
00:48:14.100 --> 00:48:19.600
servant a worker and so I work and I pay my taxes. In the home

818
00:48:19.600 --> 00:48:23.200
I have a job to do care for my family and kids and I do that by being

819
00:48:23.200 --> 00:48:26.600
a good farmer and our whole family's involved in running the family

820
00:48:26.600 --> 00:48:29.900
farm and we do that. And in the church, I have responsibilities I go

821
00:48:29.900 --> 00:48:30.300
to church.

822
00:48:30.300 --> 00:48:31.300
I hear God's word.

823
00:48:31.300 --> 00:48:33.300
I pray for my pastor.

824
00:48:33.300 --> 00:48:35.800
I encourage others by being present.

825
00:48:35.800 --> 00:48:38.400
I receive God's gifts in the Lord's Supper and encourage others to do

826
00:48:38.400 --> 00:48:38.500
the same.

827
00:48:38.500 --> 00:48:40.400
And so each of these three areas.

828
00:48:40.400 --> 00:48:43.500
I'm fulfilling my responsibilities and when I'm doing that,

829
00:48:44.200 --> 00:48:48.700
I'm being a good creature, good friend to my fellow-creatures, a good servant to my

830
00:48:48.700 --> 00:48:51.200
fellow-creatures. And I'm doing good works

831
00:48:51.200 --> 00:48:55.000
according to God's command not to serve my self or to win blessings

832
00:48:55.000 --> 00:48:55.090
from God.

833
00:48:55.090 --> 00:48:59.300
But to serve my neighbor and to care for him and to meet his needs. So in

834
00:48:59.300 --> 00:48:59.900
those three Estates

835
00:48:59.900 --> 00:49:03.900
I do these things. Now here we have four hundred years later.

836
00:49:03.900 --> 00:49:06.900
We have Dietrich Bonhoeffer or 400 plus.

837
00:49:06.900 --> 00:49:09.200
He's writing this in the 1940s.

838
00:49:09.200 --> 00:49:12.900
So we have four hundred years later Bonhoeffer's writing about the

839
00:49:12.900 --> 00:49:18.200
four mandates. And the four mandates track right on top of these three

840
00:49:18.200 --> 00:49:24.000
Estates. So the four mandates are the Church, the state, home and then labor.

841
00:49:24.000 --> 00:49:29.200
The only difference is like 3 and 4 is Bonhoeffer splits out work

842
00:49:29.200 --> 00:49:32.100
from home, which makes sense because in Luther's day

843
00:49:32.900 --> 00:49:37.300
the home was where you did your work and the home was where you carried

844
00:49:37.300 --> 00:49:40.100
out your occupation whether you are a farmer and the whole family was

845
00:49:40.100 --> 00:49:43.600
farming or you were merchants and you lived in your little apartment

846
00:49:43.600 --> 00:49:47.400
up above the place to work where you need the donuts and the pretzels

847
00:49:47.400 --> 00:49:48.600
will be Bavarian today.

848
00:49:48.600 --> 00:49:51.600
And so you would go downstairs and do the work and that you did your

849
00:49:51.600 --> 00:49:52.200
Merchants work.

850
00:49:52.200 --> 00:49:53.300
Then you would go back upstairs.

851
00:49:53.300 --> 00:49:56.400
And so the life of the family in the work was all rolled up together.

852
00:49:56.400 --> 00:50:00.200
It was hardly anybody living in Luther's day

853
00:50:00.200 --> 00:50:02.000
were home and work

854
00:50:02.000 --> 00:50:02.900
were not bound up together.

855
00:50:02.900 --> 00:50:05.000
You didn't leave home to go to work.

856
00:50:05.000 --> 00:50:08.400
It's not how it operated how it worked for anybody. But for Bonhoeffer's

857
00:50:08.400 --> 00:50:12.900
day, 400 years later, it has become that. Work is now. Society has

858
00:50:12.900 --> 00:50:16.400
shifted and so work has now pulled away from the home so now that's why he

859
00:50:16.400 --> 00:50:17.300
treats work separately.

860
00:50:17.300 --> 00:50:25.100
So he talks about the four-mandates of Labor, church, home and state. And then what Bonhoeffer does then in these

861
00:50:25.100 --> 00:50:27.000
last four pages of this essay.

862
00:50:27.700 --> 00:50:32.400
The last five pages the essay is he just unpacks each one of these

863
00:50:32.400 --> 00:50:36.900
Estates, mandates, and thinks about what this means to live

864
00:50:36.900 --> 00:50:40.300
in my mandate for the sake of my neighbor and that's what we should

865
00:50:40.300 --> 00:50:41.100
all be doing.

866
00:50:41.100 --> 00:50:42.500
We should all be asking.

867
00:50:42.500 --> 00:50:43.100
Okay.

868
00:50:43.100 --> 00:50:46.900
So God has put me in this world and I have been put first of all

869
00:50:46.900 --> 00:50:47.600
into a family.

870
00:50:47.600 --> 00:50:48.800
What do I owe my family?

871
00:50:48.800 --> 00:50:51.000
So as a daughter or son?

872
00:50:51.000 --> 00:50:55.800
What do I do owe my parents obedience or my siblings. Kindness,

873
00:50:55.800 --> 00:51:02.500
encouragements and we all work together to honor of God and to serve

874
00:51:02.500 --> 00:51:03.000
each other.

875
00:51:03.000 --> 00:51:06.200
That's what I owe my family members are part of my family. If I'm a

876
00:51:06.200 --> 00:51:06.700
parent.

877
00:51:06.700 --> 00:51:10.800
What do I owe my family? Well I got to provide for them and also got

878
00:51:10.800 --> 00:51:11.400
to do things like

879
00:51:12.800 --> 00:51:14.300
form them into the faith.

880
00:51:14.300 --> 00:51:20.100
Form them to be good citizens. Form them to be good Christians good citizens and

881
00:51:20.100 --> 00:51:20.800
good good

882
00:51:20.800 --> 00:51:21.600
good people.

883
00:51:21.600 --> 00:51:22.200
That's my job. I need to habituate them.

884
00:51:22.200 --> 00:51:27.300
I can't just provide for them send them off to school and hopefully turn out right that's absurd.

885
00:51:27.300 --> 00:51:28.300
I've got

886
00:51:28.300 --> 00:51:35.000
a responsibility into following Christ that's my vocation. Part of my Divine mandate if I have a

887
00:51:35.000 --> 00:51:36.000
spouse, what do I need to do?

888
00:51:36.000 --> 00:51:38.900
I die to myself I live for the sake of the other.

889
00:51:38.900 --> 00:51:40.300
I encourage my spouse.

890
00:51:40.300 --> 00:51:41.700
I find out how I can help them.

891
00:51:41.700 --> 00:51:42.800
I help them to be

892
00:51:42.800 --> 00:51:45.500
what God has created them to be. I find ways to build them up.

893
00:51:45.500 --> 00:51:47.900
That's my mandate given to me by God.

894
00:51:47.900 --> 00:51:51.700
That's my vocation. So I shift into my workplace my labor.

895
00:51:51.700 --> 00:51:52.400
So what do I do?

896
00:51:52.400 --> 00:51:54.800
I serve my boss,

897
00:51:54.800 --> 00:51:56.700
well. I put in a full day's work.

898
00:51:56.700 --> 00:51:58.500
I work diligently while I'm at work.

899
00:51:58.500 --> 00:52:02.200
I do what I need to do after hours to enhance his business.

900
00:52:02.200 --> 00:52:03.300
If I'm an employer.

901
00:52:03.300 --> 00:52:07.000
I treat my employees fairly. I give them what they need so that I can

902
00:52:07.000 --> 00:52:10.100
honor God through my my work as an employer.

903
00:52:10.100 --> 00:52:11.900
So I actually serve my workers.

904
00:52:12.800 --> 00:52:17.500
And I help my fellow workers by setting a good example by encouraging

905
00:52:17.500 --> 00:52:20.800
them and their work and encouraging them to be faithful. So in my labor

906
00:52:20.800 --> 00:52:21.600
I do things God's way. So in the state what do I do? Alright, so

907
00:52:21.600 --> 00:52:28.200
we're not living in Luther's feudal Middle Ages anymore. So what do I do?

908
00:52:28.200 --> 00:52:31.000
What do I do? Pay my taxes?

909
00:52:31.000 --> 00:52:33.800
I obey the speed limits the other laws of the land.

910
00:52:33.800 --> 00:52:35.100
I have uphold the government.

911
00:52:35.100 --> 00:52:36.300
I pray for my leaders.

912
00:52:36.300 --> 00:52:40.900
I hold them accountable when something is not going right I contact

913
00:52:40.900 --> 00:52:43.400
them and encourage them not to do what they're doing or to vote a

914
00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:44.400
certain way on a piece of legislation.

915
00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:49.200
I become informed and I vote in a wise way and I don't ignore my

916
00:52:49.200 --> 00:52:50.100
responsibility to vote.

917
00:52:50.100 --> 00:52:55.600
I try to get uphold the government institutions like the police and the

918
00:52:55.600 --> 00:52:58.700
Army and I do my part to try to encourage them. Maybe that means sending a

919
00:52:58.700 --> 00:53:01.900
care package to a soldier or waving at a policeman.

920
00:53:01.900 --> 00:53:06.100
That's what I do cuz I'm here to uphold the work of the state and do

921
00:53:06.100 --> 00:53:08.800
my job as as a citizen of this nation.

922
00:53:08.800 --> 00:53:12.500
And as a part of the government, that's why I vote and I participate.

923
00:53:12.800 --> 00:53:19.000
So that's what I do. Now in all these areas home and labor and state Bonhoeffer

924
00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:22.900
recognized I have task to do and I do those in my vocations and

925
00:53:22.900 --> 00:53:25.800
every one of them the goal was always to serve the other to live for

926
00:53:25.800 --> 00:53:28.500
the sake of the other. Bonhoeffer is sounding exactly like Luther. he is so Lutheran here.

927
00:53:28.500 --> 00:53:36.600
And then he also recognizes that in

928
00:53:36.600 --> 00:53:40.700
everyone of these Estates in fact the phase that he uses is. That in each one of these he says it is the race of Cain to fulfill this mandate and

929
00:53:40.700 --> 00:53:43.400
that is what cast the darkest shadow over all human labor.

930
00:53:43.400 --> 00:53:47.600
And so in every one of these mandates, he says that the shadow of Cain

931
00:53:47.600 --> 00:53:51.100
falls over this mandate and what he means then is this.

932
00:53:51.900 --> 00:53:56.100
We're under no illusions that in every one of these mandates labor

933
00:53:56.100 --> 00:53:57.300
State and home.

934
00:53:57.300 --> 00:54:00.000
The shadow of Cain is also being cast.

935
00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:05.800
So Cain the self-serving rebel who kills his brother for the sake of

936
00:54:05.800 --> 00:54:10.100
his own righteousness for the sake of his own pride.

937
00:54:10.100 --> 00:54:14.500
He slashes out and takes the life of a takes the life of Abel. That Cain. That Cain

938
00:54:14.500 --> 00:54:18.900
continues to cast a shadow over all human institutions and over all of

939
00:54:18.900 --> 00:54:20.800
our vocations are not perfect.

940
00:54:20.800 --> 00:54:25.200
We are still sinners we mess up. So our homes become places of tension

941
00:54:25.200 --> 00:54:28.900
and our work we fail. And in our job in the state

942
00:54:28.900 --> 00:54:31.700
we don't carry it out the way we should. And so we have to fight

943
00:54:31.700 --> 00:54:35.500
against the shadow of Cain and work to overcome it and to be the

944
00:54:35.500 --> 00:54:37.500
Church of God has called us to be it's always a battle.

945
00:54:37.500 --> 00:54:41.100
It's a battle for us individually, but we keep on striving to do this.

946
00:54:41.100 --> 00:54:46.400
And then the 4th mandate what about church. Bonhoeffer treats this one differently.  He says the church is

947
00:54:46.400 --> 00:54:49.700
different than all the others because the church suffuses all of them. And teaches us to see all of these in the reality of

948
00:54:51.900 --> 00:54:56.600
Christ and to be able to nuance my responsibilities and those in the

949
00:54:56.600 --> 00:55:00.100
reality of who I am in Christ. And so he doesn't brilliantly of keeping

950
00:55:00.100 --> 00:55:01.800
things in check and letting the church be there.

951
00:55:01.800 --> 00:55:05.800
I would also add that even in the church I have responsibilities to

952
00:55:05.800 --> 00:55:08.700
attend church, to receive God's gifts,  participate as a Christian.

953
00:55:08.700 --> 00:55:13.100
I have responsibilities and vocations there as well. Now what this means

954
00:55:13.100 --> 00:55:18.900
then is there is no cookie cutter way of life for the Christian. It's is not like everyone of

955
00:55:18.900 --> 00:55:19.500
us can look the same.

956
00:55:19.500 --> 00:55:23.100
We all have different vocations within these mandates. If you're single,

957
00:55:23.100 --> 00:55:28.300
if you're a member of a huge family, if you're a CEO, if you're a

958
00:55:28.300 --> 00:55:32.200
secretary, if you're a physician, we all have radically different

959
00:55:32.200 --> 00:55:32.900
vocations.

960
00:55:32.900 --> 00:55:36.100
If you're a member of the armed services, if you are elected to serve

961
00:55:36.100 --> 00:55:41.000
in office, we all have different vocations. So we all fulfill our vocation different ways with

962
00:55:41.000 --> 00:55:47.300
different emphases. So we're not all going to look the same. But we are all going to be pursuing the same goal which is to serve our neighbor and to

963
00:55:47.300 --> 00:55:49.400
bring honor to God but we're doing them in different ways.

964
00:55:49.400 --> 00:55:50.400
So there's not going to be, as I said, this cookie cutter way approach.

965
00:55:51.900 --> 00:55:55.500
So you can have some Christians and sometimes even just personal

966
00:55:55.500 --> 00:55:59.900
preference kicks in. So if I am right before God and I am right before

967
00:55:59.900 --> 00:56:01.100
my neighbor through how I live.

968
00:56:01.100 --> 00:56:04.900
I have the freedom to simply indulge in the things that serve my neighbor,

969
00:56:04.900 --> 00:56:05.600
my near neighbor.

970
00:56:05.600 --> 00:56:09.500
So if I see a great deal of racial injustice going on should I get

971
00:56:09.500 --> 00:56:12.300
involved in trying to overcome that and maybe I'll get involved by,

972
00:56:12.300 --> 00:56:16.900
you know, even protesting in the peaceful way and calling attention to the

973
00:56:16.900 --> 00:56:17.200
injustice.

974
00:56:17.200 --> 00:56:17.900
Yeah.

975
00:56:17.900 --> 00:56:20.000
There's a place for that. In the Civil Rights Movement

976
00:56:20.000 --> 00:56:24.000
the church was heavily involved and even the LCMS played a role in the

977
00:56:24.000 --> 00:56:27.900
early days of the Civil Rights Movement the 1950s surprises people, but

978
00:56:27.900 --> 00:56:31.900
we did. And there's grounded history for that never using LCMS building

979
00:56:31.900 --> 00:56:32.700
for some of their meetings.

980
00:56:32.700 --> 00:56:35.100
That's appropriate it's right. And

981
00:56:35.500 --> 00:56:39.300
so maybe I get though involved in environmental concern and I'm very

982
00:56:39.300 --> 00:56:42.800
concerned about protecting some Wetland and so I get very involved in

983
00:56:42.800 --> 00:56:46.400
my local politics and start going to Council meetings and trying to

984
00:56:46.400 --> 00:56:51.200
influence and shape the way the thing out this that's appropriate. Or

985
00:56:51.200 --> 00:56:57.000
maybe I get very concerned about the plight of refugees in Afghanistan

986
00:56:57.000 --> 00:57:00.000
or something someplace until I become very concerned about this send

987
00:57:00.000 --> 00:57:00.800
money to help with that.

988
00:57:00.800 --> 00:57:05.500
That's appropriate. See there is just this countless ways for us to be involved

989
00:57:05.500 --> 00:57:09.400
in the world, but we should be involved. We should be invested in trying to

990
00:57:09.400 --> 00:57:13.200
serve our neighbor and our vocations are near neighbor first wife, kids

991
00:57:13.200 --> 00:57:16.300
immediate family, but then others as well, we should be involved and caring.

992
00:57:16.300 --> 00:57:18.400
You should never be so insular.

993
00:57:18.400 --> 00:57:21.800
We should never ever had this bifurcated

994
00:57:21.800 --> 00:57:23.500
well, that's just the world.

995
00:57:23.500 --> 00:57:24.400
I'm a Christian.

996
00:57:24.400 --> 00:57:28.200
I'm interested in living for Christ that we we serve our Christian

997
00:57:28.200 --> 00:57:29.300
fellow brothers and sisters.

998
00:57:29.300 --> 00:57:32.800
But we also serve the world by the example, but also by intervention we

999
00:57:32.800 --> 00:57:34.800
can so we should be engaged in the world.

1000
00:57:35.500 --> 00:57:39.700
We should care about the world. We should be doing what God gives us to do in all these different

1001
00:57:39.700 --> 00:57:48.300
vocations. So Christians are not going to be looking like a homogenous group. We are not going to be fighting for the somethings. In our own congregations we will have different things we are interested in pursuing.

1002
00:57:48.300 --> 00:57:49.600
That's good.

1003
00:57:49.600 --> 00:57:50.500
That's right.

1004
00:57:50.500 --> 00:57:54.900
That's appropriate so we can get engaged in the things that matter but

1005
00:57:54.900 --> 00:57:57.600
we also have to make sure that they are things that matter to God and

1006
00:57:57.600 --> 00:58:00.300
are in sync with his justice.

1007
00:58:00.300 --> 00:58:03.000
Alright. So those are the things I really needed to get covered today.

1008
00:58:03.000 --> 00:58:04.100
Those were on my agenda.

1009
00:58:04.100 --> 00:58:07.100
I've got some other loose end things here and there of course, but those are

1010
00:58:07.100 --> 00:58:10.900
the main things.  We got about little less than 20 minutes now little one

1011
00:58:10.900 --> 00:58:15.400
in 15 20 questions you guys have this is your chance whether by e-mail

1012
00:58:15.400 --> 00:58:19.200
or by just raise your hand and ask it out loud and I'd love to be

1013
00:58:19.200 --> 00:58:22.200
able to address any of the questions you guys have any loose ends and

1014
00:58:22.200 --> 00:58:24.700
maybe tie some things up or explore some new things

1015
00:58:24.700 --> 00:58:26.600
I didn't even touch on. Any thing is fair game.

1016
00:58:26.600 --> 00:58:28.200
It's about whatever you want.

1017
00:58:28.200 --> 00:58:29.700
So this is your chance.